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Egypt: people's revolution or military coup?

Discussion in 'Regional and International Politics and News' started by ilmishka, Nov 20, 2012.

  1. ilmishka

    ilmishka New Member

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    While the former president of Egypt is in prison, a former political prisoner and the new president of Egypt is ruling the country. Year and a half ago it was hard to imagine the possibility of this life scenario for Egypt. Mubarak was in power and was resting peacefully in his villa in Sharm El Sheikh and “Muslim Brotherhood” was forbidden organization. But times changed and what seemed impossible and unacceptable, is done

    And now the fifth president of Egypt is Islamist and a former chairman of the Student Association against Zionism. A person who believes that a woman's place at home, and has radical vision of future Egypt. Of course, now he has to be more careful with words and actions as a new president of country with different religious views. But still he very often contradicts himself.

    In one interview, he said that Egypt would be a democratic country "for all", in the other - that Sharia will be given a prominent place in the new Egypt. In the third interview Morse explains that it intends to revise the international treaties, including the Camp David agreement, and in his first speech as president promised "to respect all obligations and comply with the terms of international agreements."

    So let’s have a closer look at how did situation changed after revolution and Morsi becoming a president.

    SHARIAT

    "Egypt is in the darkness”, "Valley of the Nile chooses Islam", "Fundamentalists are in power" – those are some of screaming headlines in the international press. Is it really so bad? First time in the history of Egypt the powerful leader of the Islamic movement became a president. But can and whether will Muhammad Mursi immediately convert Egypt on track of Sharia?

    While there is no stable parliament and clear constitution in Egypt, it is hard to imagine that the country of Pyramids will turn into Somalia overnight, where they cut off hands of thefts (though as scary as it may seem new government is really thinking of applying this sharia law in practice).
    Well truth to be said number of laws was already Islamic. Unlike Tunisia, polygamy is not prohibited, and clumsy attempts by the authorities to get men to report their new marriages have not been successful. Moreover, about 75% of Egyptian women are wearing hijab, so in this respect, Egypt is way far from Tunis, where Islamists have to struggle more with the secular way of life. By the way, neither in Tunisia nor in Gaza after the Islamists won Sharia was introduced.
    Also to protect young Muslims minds from bad influence of internet resources new government came up with a brilliant idea to block all porn sites in Egypt Nowdays… In this case scenario it either can help and abduction on the streets which takes place to be will be stopped… or young generation will go to streets in searching for inspiration and it will just get worse.
    On my point of view government has to concentrate on more serious problems instead… As an example a terrible car accident happened few days ago and many kids in age of 6-7 died. This unlimited loss for parents of their kids government decided to compensate to each family in amount of 4000 Egyptian pound which Is cheaper than a new brand iPhone. That is how precious life of a kid and preson in general can be. And sadly this happens on a daily basis with one small difference… most of the times families are not getting even one pound… because many cases do not reach mass media.

    There are many problems Egypt has and it is really dumb to cover real problems with the mask of religious.

    TOURISM

    Tourism is considered to bring most income to Egyptian budget…but the question is will new president understand that he has to develop this sector and not just simply ban bikinis on the beaches of Hurghada and Sharm el-Sheikh? Because these resorts are rather reminiscent of private reservation, with majority of foreigners, who are binging at least some dollars and euros to the country.
    Is it better to destroy pyramids because one of radical islamists saw in them symbol of worship (dahhh… the civilization who worshipped pharaohs died many centuries ago)… or it is better to clean up historical monuments and to be proud that Egypt is a part of such a huge civilization and history. What we have now is simply depressing image of one of the world’s most famous wonders. The pyramids do not feel proper reverence for eternity. It became kind of bazaar were you’ve been pushed, pulled and so on by several dirty looking men. Their eyes are seeking for money , hands nervously squeezing usless souvenirs which they are forcing u to buy. They look forward to when you slow down near the ashtray next to the Sphinx's head, ready to start dancing because they felt the smell of money coming on! And the matter of fact those people coming to pyramids not because of poverty, but because they are too lazy to do something else than just begging for money. I wonder why not to give each of these guys a broomstick and make Cairo the cleanest city in the world.

    So we can see that government is not thinking towards improvements in tourism sector and and not trying hard enough to make Egypt a better place to live. Time will only show how the situation will change and all we have to wait!

    ECONOMY

    During presidential program "Muslim Brotherhood" promised to create up to 3 million new jobs a year. Well.. it also can be promised that they, t will dance belly dance on top of one of the pyramids. Theoretically - it is possible, in real life- not a chance.

    If Egypt will continue to receive help from the World Bank, Saudi Arabia and the U.S., it is possible that the new president will be able to provide Egyptians with bread and water - as in the days of Hosni Mubarak. In return for assistance, all three require unquestioning obedience, and so on and so forth. And if in the United States Republican will come to power one day, subsidies to Egypt can be generally terminated or frozen.
    Moral… Egyptian government has to start thinking of their own productions… factories…to be able rise economy and not just rely on 3-d countries that will use it and just throw away as broken toy or used paper.

    DEMOCRACY

    Just like the economy, democracy under President Islamist possible only in theory. "Muslim brothers" are known for their chain of command and discipline. The spiritual leader decides - political link performs. As an example with the "brothers" will not be allowed any liberties. One of the facts is the complete absence of women in the organization of the last gatherings in Tahrir Square.

    Long-haired Egyptian feminist activists warninng each other on "Twitter" not to go to Tahrir anymore...This is not January 2011.


    CONCLUSION

    It is unlikely that with the Mursi victory in the presidential elections, the New Era for Egypt will begin. Rather - it is another phase transition. The new figure named Mohammed Mursi by itself does not mean anything: the struggle for power between the two blocs - the army and the Islamists - will not end.

    Despite the abundance of Delilah and the Egyptian flag in Tahrir Square, few people today believe that the elections were free, the new president - a champion of democracy, and that the Egyptian military is actually going to share power. The question is how long this period of transition will be and what will happen to Egypt after it ends.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2012
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  2. eLad

    eLad Well-Known Member
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    welcome to the forum ilmishka. great analysis. is it based on your personal experience in Egypt?
     
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  3. My Moria Moon

    My Moria Moon Well-Known Member

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    Apart from the experience of having lived its terrible practices and the learned lesson for the future to never again relive it, what good can the Egyptian people get out of an oppressing religious ideology that, at the age of the IPhone, FaceBook and Twitter, works on taming them back inside 14th century cages?

    All in all, I think among all the Arabs, the Moroccans, who happened to live on own far off corner from the rest, have had the best success so far in managing themselves in regard to the late aggressive rise and spread of wahhabism.

    Good luck o friendly and happy people of Egypt through the dark journey you have ahead.
     
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  4. Chris306

    Chris306 New Member

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    What has changed, what is changing? (We will have to wait until your 'new' constitution comes out before an official answer... but the tales on the ground ain't swell)

    [​IMG]

    - Women have lost many rights, gender equality has been removed
    - As you noted, pornography has been banned
    - Wording removing the criminalization of the trafficking of women & children (Salafi demand)
    - Rise of sharia tribunals (outside of the state's authority) in Sinai
    - Atheists are being arrested; tortured in jail for using Facebook
    - 'Free haircuts' are being administrated on the street; Salafi women are the barbers
    - Chrisitan children, as young as 7-years old are being arrested for blasphemy
    - There are serious talks within the Salafi Party of razing Egypt's SPHINX

    You guys better rid your country of these head bobbing douchebags before it's too late.

    I fear women may not be allowed to vote in your next election if you don't...
     
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  5. Jo

    Jo Administrator
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    Do you still have any hope for the future egypt ? and how do you think things should progress ?
     
  6. Venom

    Venom Well-Known Member

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    Egypt was more advanced at the time of the pharaons. Shariaa will put Egypt back in the 7th century.
     
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  7. Chris306

    Chris306 New Member

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    Do you know what a staple drink of the ancient Pharoah diet consisted of?

    BEER:
    http://dsc.discovery.com/tv-shows/other-shows/videos/brew-masters-pharaohs-beer.htm

    This bearded circus is hellbent on destroying the Sphinx, the Pyramids and seeking to ban beer, bikinis and hair!

    Arabs: One step forward and two steps back.

    Double Takbeer!
     
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  8. Robin Hood

    Robin Hood Well-Known Member
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    Mubarak's Egypt used to lick the Israeli boot, Mursi's Egypt is licking the Israeli pair of boots..
     
  9. Abotareq93

    Abotareq93 Well-Known Member

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    الTayyar.org يحصل على نص الإعلان الدستوري المصري الجديد: مرسي يقلب الطاولة ويعزز صلاحياته مطيحا بالقضاء

    فاجأ الرئيس المصري أحمد مرسي الرأي العام المصري والعربي بإصداره إعلانا دستوريا جديدا وسّع من صلاياته وقضم من صلاحيات القضاء وقضى بأن كل قرارات رئاسة الجمهورية المصرية منذ توليه الرئاسة لا يجوز الطعن فيها مقيلاً المدعي العام الحالي وعيّن مكانه مستشاره طلعت عبد الله لمدة أربع سنوات ما شكل سابقة في التاريخ المصري لناحية تدخل المؤسسات التنفيذية بالقضاء بهذه الطريقة الفوقية.

    ومن ضمن ما جاء في الإعلان الدستوري الجديد والذي مهّد له مرسي عبر إعلانه على حسابه عبر تويتر، كما عبر التلفزيون المصري الرسمي عن توجهه، وخلال "دقائق"، لإتخاذ قرارات هامة، أن الرئيس المصري أصدر قرارا يمنع بموجبه القضاء من حل الجمعية التأسيسية لكتابة الدستور كما باعادة التحقيقات والمحاكمات في جرائم قتل المتظاهرين إبان الثورة مخصصا لجرخى الثورة تعويضات الشهداء.

    وما إن أعلن مرسي عن قراراته هذه حتى نزل إلى الشارع الآلاف من مناصري الإخوان تأييدا للإعلان.

    هذا ويسود الترقب الشارع المصري بانتظار ردات فعل شاجبة من قبل المجتمع المصري والهيئات الحقوقية المصرية.

    هذا وقد حصل موقعنا على نص الاعلان الدستوري الجديد الذي اصدره الرئيس محمد مرسي منذ قليل، ونصه كالتالي:

    "المادة الأولى: تعاد التحقيقات فى كافة الجرائم التى ارتكبت ضد الثوار بواسطة كل منصب سياسى أو تنفيذى فى ظل النظام السابق وفى ظل قانون حماية الثورة

    المادة الثانية: الإعلانات الدستورية وقرارات الرئيس منذ 30 يونيو الماضى، وحتى نفاذ الدستور تكون نهائية وغير قابلة للطعن عليها وتنقضى كافة القضايا المنظورة أمام القضاء

    المادة الثالثة: يعين المستشار طلعت إبراهيم نائبا عاما جديدا لمدة 4 سنوات.

    الماده الخامسة:

    لا يجوز لأى جهه قضائيه حل ملجس الشورى او اللجنه التأسسيه.

    الماده السادسة:

    لرئيس الجمهوريه اذا قام خطر يهدد البلد وسلامته او يعوق مؤسساته ان يتخذ الاجراءات والتدابير على النحو الذى ينظمه القانون

    منح رئيس الجمهورية حق اتخاذ إجراءات استثنائية لحماية الثورة ولا يجوز لأي جهة قضائية حل مجلس الشورى أو الجمعية التأسيسية.
     
  10. ah ya balad

    ah ya balad Member

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    وكأن مصر مواكبة للعالم وللقرن 21. كلنا نعرف مصر جيدا على ايام مبارك
    ثم منذ متى الشريعة كانت هي العائق في تطوير البلاد؟ اليست إيران بلدا قائما على الشريعة؟
     
  11. Abotareq93

    Abotareq93 Well-Known Member

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    19:49 عمرو موسى عبر Twitter: مصر تدخل مرحلة مختلفة، ليست هي مرحلة الديمقراطية التي كنا نأملها أو سيادة القانون التي طالبنا بها... ربنا يستر!
     
  12. Abotareq93

    Abotareq93 Well-Known Member

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    19:19 عمرو موسى: لن نقبل بدكتاتور جديد والديمقراطية هي الحلّ
    18:55 البرادعي: مرسي نسف مفهوم الدولة والشرعية ونصب نفسه حاكما بأمر الله
     
  13. ah ya balad

    ah ya balad Member

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    عمرو موسى ومحمد البرادعي دايما يذكروني بنجاح واكيم وزاهر الخطيب، جعجعة الفاضي
     
  14. loubnaniTO

    loubnaniTO Well-Known Member
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    عمرو موسى عبر
    Twitter:
    مصر تدخل مرحلة مختلفة، ليست هي مرحلة الديمقراطية التي كنا نأملها أو سيادة القانون التي طالبنا بها... ربنا يستر!​


    Dear Arab Freedom Fighters,

    Rebelling against dictators and calling for freedoms is a sacred fight.... but sometimes you have to consider the alternatives and what you might be stuck with!! A dictator is BAD...... a religious dictator might be MUCH worse.

    Regards.
     
  15. Danny Z

    Danny Z Legendary Member

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    He managed to get Gaza under his wing and please the US, for that Morsi's coup against the law will not be sanctioned by the west and he will be protected and cherished same as Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Turkey and all those Islamist dictator run countries. The noose is tightening around Iran & Syria. Many countries are joining the US axis. Gaza is nullified, West Bank is not dangerous, Syria is battling its own problems. Iran and HA are now the next focus.
     
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  16. kmarthe

    kmarthe Well-Known Member

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    It is funny when you praise Iran here, and attack wilayat al faqih wa hezb el sila7 in another threat. The least that can be said is this schyzophrenia haboub!! Don't worry, it is the common desease of the Jarabs!! Nothing scary :tongue:

    Now that the new morshed a3la is being installed in Egypt, the "freedom and democracy" struggles of your friends who elected him will be coming to a brutal end!! Soon, the one who dares to criticize the morshed will be beheaded in Midan al tahrir!! Long live El Mourshed and his sheeps who elected him :clap:
     
  17. ecce homo

    ecce homo Well-Known Member
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    Egypt protest call over President Mursi's sweeping powers

    [​IMG]

    BBC News

    Opposition leaders in Egypt have called for large protests after President Mohammed Mursi passed a decree giving himself sweeping new powers.

    The decree states the president's decisions cannot be revoked by any authority - including the judiciary.

    It also opens the way for a retrial of people convicted of killings during Egypt's 2011 uprising which toppled President Hosni Mubarak.

    Mr Mursi's critics have denounced the move as a "coup against legitimacy".

    In a joint news conference on Thursday, Sameh Ashour, head of the lawyers syndicate, and key opposition figures Mohamed ElBaradei and Amr Moussa accused Mr Mursi of "monopolising all three branches of government" and overseeing "the total execution of the independence of the judiciary".

    "We are calling on all Egyptians to protest in all of Egypt's squares on Friday," they said.

    Mr ElBaradei, a Nobel Peace Prize winner, wrote on his Twitter account that the president had "appointed himself Egypt's new pharaoh. A major blow to the revolution that could have dire consequences".

    Wael Ghonim, a key figure in the uprising, said the revolution had not been staged "in search of a benign dictator".

    "There is a difference between revolutionary decisions and dictatorial decisions," he said.

    But Mr Mursi's supporters say the move will protect Egypt's revolution. Thousands celebrated the decree in front of the Egyptian High Court in Cairo on Thursday night.

    Mahmoud Ghozlan, spokesman for Mr Mursi's Muslim Brotherhood party, described it as "revolutionary and popular."

    The BBC's Jon Leyne in Cairo says that after brokering a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas over the Gaza crisis, Mr Mursi has won a new international prestige, and must believe this will help him weather the domestic storm.

    Mubarak retrial?

    Mr Mursi said his decree was aimed at "cleansing state institutions" and "destroying the infrastructure of the old regime".

    It bans challenges to his decrees, laws and decisions, and says no court can dissolve the constituent assembly, which is drawing up a new constitution.

    Mr Mursi also sacked chief prosecutor Abdel Maguid Mahmoud and ordered the retrial of people accused of attacking protesters in the uprising, which could lead to the retrial of Mubarak himself, who is serving a life sentence.

    Mr Mahmoud's acquittal of officers accused of involvement in attacks on protesters led to violent clashes in Cairo's Tahrir Square in October, when supporters and opponents of Mr Mursi clashed.

    Thousands of protesters have returned to the streets around Tahrir Square over the past week demanding political reforms and the prosecution of officials blamed for killing demonstrators.

    The president had tried to remove Mr Mahmoud from his post by appointing him envoy to the Vatican.

    But Mr Mahmoud defied the Egyptian leader and returned to work, escorted by judges and lawyers.

    New prosecutor Talaat Ibrahim is tasked with re-examining all the investigations led by Mr Mahmoud into the deaths of protesters, and re-trying people already acquitted in the case.

    The declaration also gives the 100-member constituent assembly two additional months to draft a new constitution, to replace the one suspended after Mr Mubarak was overthrown.

    The rewrite of the constitution, which was meant to be finished by December, has been plagued by lawsuits questioning the make-up of the constituent assembly.

    Once completed, the document is due to be put to a referendum. If it is approved, legislative elections will be held two months later.
     
  18. ecce homo

    ecce homo Well-Known Member
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    22 November declaration

    • All investigations into the killing of protesters or the use of violence against them will be re-conducted; trials of those accused will be re-held
    • All constitutional declarations, laws and decrees made since Mr Mursi assumed power cannot be appealed or cancelled by any individual, or political or governmental body
    • The public prosecutor will be appointed by the president for a fixed term of four years, and must be aged at least 40
    • The constituent assembly's timeline for drafting the new constitution has been extended by two months
    • No judicial authority can dissolve the constituent assembly or the the upper house of parliament (Shura Council)
    • The president is authorised to take any measures he sees fit in order to preserve the revolution, to preserve national unity or to safeguard national security

    BBC News
     
  19. ecce homo

    ecce homo Well-Known Member
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    Analysis

    Yolande Knell
    BBC News


    He might be riding high in international opinion because of his role helping to secure a ceasefire between Israel and Gaza, but Egypt's President Mursi is still facing pressing domestic issues.

    Mr Mursi's announcement that he is sacking the unpopular public prosecutor - an appointee of his predecessor - and ordering the retrial of leaders of Hosni Mubarak's regime - is an attempt to satisfy the demands of the young "revolutionaries".

    Yet many will be alarmed by the extensive powers that the president has now granted himself - largely to see off ongoing legal challenges.

    The constituent assembly drawing up the new constitution - which is dominated by Islamists and criticised by secular political forces - is being given special protection to complete its work so that Egypt has a new governing document and can proceed to new legislative elections.

    But of most concern is the line that Mr Mursi's decisions "are final and cannot be contested". He starts to sound more powerful than the autocratic leader that Egyptians rose up to overthrow.
     
  20. Weezy

    Weezy Well-Known Member

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    The Egyptians can simply elect another one after his term ends if they are dissatisfied. If we start seeing 99% in electoral results again then they have every right to hit the streets and topple him.
     

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