Al Yawmul Quds Al Alami - International Quds (Jerusalem) Day

NewLeb

NewLeb

New Member
I agree that Jerusalem will eventually return to its rightful owners- the Muslims.

However, it won’t happen until the Islamic world is once again in a state of technological, economical, and societal superiority to that of the West, as it was in the past.

Clearly Iran is prioritizing something that it has no chance of accomplishing in the condition that it is presently in. This is why they do not get my support.
 
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  • Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    As far as I know @Big Brother has stated many times that he's half Lebanese Christian half Jewish, and is proud of both his identities. And yes, he has 100% the right to call Israel and Jerusalem home, since all Jews are originally from there. Unlike Arabs from Morocco to Yemen who have no historical connection to the Holy Land and still think they are entitled to it just because Arab Muslim colonialists owned it for some time.
    You want to take us back and go over another round of discussion over who's indigenous and who's not. In the end, you'd find out that no one in the Levant is indigenous as you think history started 5000 years ago. History didnt start in the Levant 5000 years ago. There are Palestinians of Assyrian and Samritan roots. Of every root that have stepped foot in Palestine. The forebears of the Israelites themselves, from whom the Jews claim descent came from Mesopotamia. Because Jews ruled for a short period and made their kingdoms doesnt also give you exclusive rights. How fake is claiming any right when being a Jew is an ethno religious nomenclature and includes White European converts to Judaism. You cant convert a Japanese to Islam and then tell me he has gotten right to relocate to Makkah. It makes no sense. The reason you should return to Europe.
     
    Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    I agree that Jerusalem will eventually return to its rightful owners- the Muslims.

    However, it won’t happen until the Islamic world is once again in a state of technological, economical, and societal superiority to that of the West, as it was in the past.

    Clearly Iran is prioritizing something that it has no chance of accomplishing in the condition that it is presently in. This is why they do not get my support.
    Iran doesnt get your support, if at all you are a Muslim, because of sectarian jealousy. Our sectarian division is the biggest curse that has afflicted us as Muslims. It is killing us. Otherwise, with its growth, despite decades of sanctions and isolations, Iran has proven that we can be great again. And we can be great again whether America, Russia, and China and Israehell like it or not. That means even if all the supreme non Muslim powers gather to weaken us, we can be great again if we unite. All it needs is for those cowards in the Gulf to put Muslims and their people first and stop being cowards. They're throwing away billions of dollars to buy Americans weapons that they dont really need. The US end up robbing them of both the oil and their petroleum dollars. Senseless!!! The Arabs and Persians have coexisted for centuries before America was born. The greatest scholars in Sunni Islam were Persian. So the rivalry is this sense of sectarian rivalry, which we can stop. It isnt even ethnic, except if you want to tell me that Americans are descendants of Yemeni or Arabian clans and the Iranians are not. For God's sake, there are even Iranian Arabs. The unity of Iran and the rest of the Muslim world is an Islamic obligation and an Islamic necessity. Otherwise, Muslims, all Muslims would continue to struggle.
     
    Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    The Christians in the Palestinian territories (barely any left) are persecuted by their Muslim neighbors, not Israel. When Israel controlled Bethlehem it was 80-90% Christian, 25 years have passed since the Palestinian Authority took control and now Christians make up only 10-15% of the population, if even. Not to mention Christians in Gaza, who lived literally in ISIS-like conditions.

    I've posted many times the data and you already know it. Christians in Israel proper are the most educated and successful group in the country, even more than Jews. They have the best schools, and lowest % of unemployment and poverty. They are also overrepresented in colleges and universities (almost 15% of all students despite being only 2% of the population), especially in the medical and engineering fields. Knowing all of that, do you seriously believe Christians are better off in the Palestinian territories than Israel?!
    ISIS like conditions exist in Gaza because there is a blockade. Palestinians are holding on to their land and existence. Many people would rather flee. If I am placed under siege or living under blockade, I'd likely leave to another place, maybe because I can.

    You should not pretend you didnt watch those four videos. And there are many more on YouTube. If you are suffering from cognitive dissonance, it is not my fault.
     
    Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    How many times will I have to teach you that the only groups that come close to being 100% native to the Levant are Christians, Samaritans, Druze and of course Mizrahi Jews (majority of Israel). And even Ashkenazim are predominantly Israelite by blood and way more native than the Arab Muslims who occupy the region.

    Khazaria, really? That theory has been debunked long ago. Khazars were a Turkic people. Do Ashkenazim look Turkic? Nope, they look mostly Mediterranean or Levantine. So if you wanna be anti-Semitic, at least get your facts straight.

    Second, Jews were never considered native in Europe. Why do you think all the pogroms and the Holocaust happened? It's not simply because of their religion, Jews were not seen as simply Europeans with a Jewish religion. They were seen as foreign and inferior semites of a different race who came from the Middle East, just like the Roma people (gypsies) who came from India and were never seen as native by Europeans.
    I'm so worried now you are trying to brandish the antisemitism label on me for stating the obvious. Very typical when you are cornered. You debunk what you want and as you like, and you conduct genetic studies and build a castle of analysis and claims based on one isolated trace in a genome. On the same basis I can claim China and justify why I should become the King of China. You dont need to provide reasons why Europeans were antisemitic. Just like Christianity left the Middle East and found receptive converts, Judaism did too. Italians, Spanish, Portugese and others are Mediterranean and even among them there are the blonde ones. Same with Judaists.

    I'm not going down this path of ancestry and your fake narrative about Druze, Christians and Jews having similar genetic patterns. Druze are mostly descended from Arabian clans FYI. Take the Arslan family as a case study. They're descended from an Arabian clan that settled in Iraq and later moved to the Levant. The Jumblatt family is of Kurdish origin.

    This sort of discussion is just a deflection from facing the reality of the day which is occupation. Even if I have no ancestral root in a land, another person has no right to victimized me and dehumanize me. You dont dehumanize people because they dont have ancestral links to a land. You condemn them if they act like Zionists and behave in an inhumane and racist way, stripping others of their human rights and treating them like animals.
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    You want to take us back and go over another round of discussion over who's indigenous and who's not. In the end, you'd find out that no one in the Levant is indigenous as you think history started 5000 years ago. History didnt start in the Levant 5000 years ago. There are Palestinians of Assyrian and Samritan roots. Of every root that have stepped foot in Palestine. The forebears of the Israelites themselves, from whom the Jews claim descent came from Mesopotamia. Because Jews ruled for a short period and made their kingdoms doesnt also give you exclusive rights. How fake is claiming any right when being a Jew is an ethno religious nomenclature and includes White European converts to Judaism. You cant convert a Japanese to Islam and then tell me he has gotten right to relocate to Makkah. It makes no sense. The reason you should return to Europe.

    Abraham came from Mesopotamia. Israelites emerged as a native Canaanite subgroup in the Levant after he came and united the tribes, becoming a monotheist group.


    "Based on the archaeological evidence, according to the modern archaeological account, the Israelites and their culture did not overtake the region by force, but instead branched out of the indigenous Canaanite peoples that long inhabited the Southern Levant, Syria, ancient Israel, and the Transjordan region through a gradual evolution of a distinct monolatristic—later cementing as monotheistic—religion centered on Yahweh. The outgrowth of Yahweh-centric monolatrism from Canaanite polytheism started with Yahwism, the belief in the existence of the many gods and goddesses of the Canaanite pantheon but with the consistent worship of only Yahweh. Along with a number of cultic practices, this gave rise to a separate Israelite ethnic group identity. The final transition of their Yahweh-based religion to monotheism and rejection of the existence of the other Canaanite gods set the Israelites apart from their fellow Canaanite brethren. The Israelites, however, continued to retain various cultural commonalities with other Canaanites, including use of one of the Canaanite dialects, Hebrew, which is today the only living descendant of that language group."

     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    ISIS like conditions exist in Gaza because there is a blockade. Palestinians are holding on to their land and existence. Many people would rather flee. If I am placed under siege or living under blockade, I'd likely leave to another place, maybe because I can.

    You should not pretend you didnt watch those four videos. And there are many more on YouTube. If you are suffering from cognitive dissonance, it is not my fault.

    Please be impartial and explain the fact that Christians are the most prosperous, educated and successful group in Israel. Even more than Jews.

    "In 2016 Christian Arabs had the highest rates of success at matriculation examinations, namely 73.9%, both in comparison to Muslim and Druze Israelis (41% and 51.9% respectively), and to the students from the different branches of the Hebrew (majority Jewish) education system considered as one group (55.1%).

    Statistically, Christian Arabs in Israel have the highest rates of educational attainment among all religious communities, according to a data by Israel Central Bureau of Statistics in 2010, 63% of Christian Arabs have had college or postgraduate education, the highest of any religious group. Despite the fact that Arab Christians only represent 2.1% of the total Israeli population, in 2014 they accounted for 17.0% of the country's university students, and for 14.4% of its college students.

    In 2013, Arab Christian students were also the vanguard in terms of eligibility for higher education, as the Christian Arab students had the highest rates of receiving Psychometric Entrance Test scores which make them eligible for acceptance into universities, data from the Israel Central Bureau of Statistics show that 61% of Christian Arabs were eligible for university studies, compared to 50% of Jewish, 45% of Druze, and 35% of Muslim students.

    In terms of their socio-economic situation, Arab Christians are more similar to the Jewish population than to the Muslim Arab population. They have the lowest incidence of poverty and the lowest percentage of unemployment which is 4.9% compared to 6.5% among Jewish men and women."
     
    Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    Abraham came from Mesopotamia. Israelites emerged as a native Canaanite subgroup in the Levant after he came and united the tribes, becoming a monotheist group.


    "Based on the archaeological evidence, according to the modern archaeological account, the Israelites and their culture did not overtake the region by force, but instead branched out of the indigenous Canaanite peoples that long inhabited the Southern Levant, Syria, ancient Israel, and the Transjordan region through a gradual evolution of a distinct monolatristic—later cementing as monotheistic—religion centered on Yahweh. The outgrowth of Yahweh-centric monolatrism from Canaanite polytheism started with Yahwism, the belief in the existence of the many gods and goddesses of the Canaanite pantheon but with the consistent worship of only Yahweh. Along with a number of cultic practices, this gave rise to a separate Israelite ethnic group identity. The final transition of their Yahweh-based religion to monotheism and rejection of the existence of the other Canaanite gods set the Israelites apart from their fellow Canaanite brethren. The Israelites, however, continued to retain various cultural commonalities with other Canaanites, including use of one of the Canaanite dialects, Hebrew, which is today the only living descendant of that language group."

    Do you want to know what is the implication of this?
     
    Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    Please be impartial and explain the fact that Christians are the most prosperous, educated and successful group in Israel. Even more than Jews.

    "In 2016 Christian Arabs had the highest rates of success at matriculation examinations, namely 73.9%, both in comparison to Muslim and Druze Israelis (41% and 51.9% respectively), and to the students from the different branches of the Hebrew (majority Jewish) education system considered as one group (55.1%).

    Statistically, Christian Arabs in Israel have the highest rates of educational attainment among all religious communities, according to a data by Israel Central Bureau of Statistics in 2010, 63% of Christian Arabs have had college or postgraduate education, the highest of any religious group. Despite the fact that Arab Christians only represent 2.1% of the total Israeli population, in 2014 they accounted for 17.0% of the country's university students, and for 14.4% of its college students.

    In 2013, Arab Christian students were also the vanguard in terms of eligibility for higher education, as the Christian Arab students had the highest rates of receiving Psychometric Entrance Test scores which make them eligible for acceptance into universities, data from the Israel Central Bureau of Statistics show that 61% of Christian Arabs were eligible for university studies, compared to 50% of Jewish, 45% of Druze, and 35% of Muslim students.

    In terms of their socio-economic situation, Arab Christians are more similar to the Jewish population than to the Muslim Arab population. They have the lowest incidence of poverty and the lowest percentage of unemployment which is 4.9% compared to 6.5% among Jewish men and women."
    Maybe we should get you the grades Jewish students used to attain in Nazi Germany and then build a claim that because Jewish students were very bright and intelligent at school and attained high grades,therefore the holocaust did not take place or that they weren't persecuted in europe. Can you not be stupid for once.
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    Maybe we should get you the grades Jewish students used to attain in Nazi Germany and then build a claim that because Jewish students were very bright and intelligent at school and attained high grades,therefore the holocaust did not take place or that they weren't persecuted in europe. Can you not be stupid for once.

    It's not just education, Christians are the most socioeconomically prosperous group.

    "In Israel, Arab Christians are portrayed as a hard-working and upper-middle-class educated ethno-religious minority."


    "Recently, there has been a steady undercurrent of Christians who seek deeper integration into Israeli society. Under the leadership of Greek Orthodox priest Gabriel Naddaf, United Allies is a political party that advocates Christian enlistment in the IDF and a more distinct societal separation of Christians from Muslims. This separation is partly based on the purported fact that Christians in Israel are not technically Arabs, seeing as they were present in the Holy Land long before the Arab conquest, hallmarked by the Siege of Jerusalem. This distinction is in the process of being formalized into law, as the Likud government is currently drafting legislation to grant this request.

    This new attitude is founded largely by the perception by some that only in Israel the Christian population is growing due to natural increase and no state persecution, seeing the entire Middle East, except Lebanon, as where Christianity is and has been rapidly on the decline. In addition, increasing numbers of Christian leaders and community members are pointing to Muslim violence as a threat to their way of life in Arab majority cities and towns."




    Jewish Rabbis are protecting and helping persecuted Christians:

    Orthodox Rabbis founded charity fundraising initiative Blessing Bethlehem, which aim to aid the persecuted Christian community of Bethlehem,
    in part, and the larger persecuted Christian community of the Middle East region and throughout the world.


    In 2008, Rabbi Shlomo Riskin, the chief rabbi of Efrat, established the Center for Jewish–Christian Understanding and Cooperation or CJCUC, the first Orthodox Jewish institution to dialogue with the Christian world on a religious and theological basis. The center, currently located in Jerusalem, engages in Hebraic Bible Study for Christians, from both the local community and from abroad, has organized numerous interfaith praise initiatives, such as Day to Praise, and has established many fund-raising initiatives such as Blessing Bethlehem which aim to aid the persecuted Christian community of Bethlehem, in part, and the larger persecuted Christian community of the Middle East region and throughout the world.


    Christian party encourages full integration of Arabophone Christians into Israeli society, the two-state solution, and enlistment of Arab speaking Christians into the Israel Defense Forces.



    Christians leaving mixed Christian-Muslim towns for Jewish areas:


    The party's founder, Bishara Shilyan, said he wants to build a 30.5-metre (100 ft) tall statue of Jesus (modelled on Rio de Janeiro's Christ the Redeemer statue) on top of a mountain in Nazareth. He said the purpose of the statue would be to prevent Nazareth's Christian heritage from being eroded. The town's Christian population has been steadily decreasing relative to its Muslim population, with Christian residents leaving to the predominately Jewish cities of Nazareth Illit, Shfar'am, and Haifa.



    Christians are persecuted in Israel, you say? What an insult to the Christians of Egypt, Iraq, Syria and Palestinian territories, who are literally being genocided as we speak.
     
    Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    It's not just education, Christians are the most socioeconomically prosperous group.

    "In Israel, Arab Christians are portrayed as a hard-working and upper-middle-class educated ethno-religious minority."


    "Recently, there has been a steady undercurrent of Christians who seek deeper integration into Israeli society. Under the leadership of Greek Orthodox priest Gabriel Naddaf, United Allies is a political party that advocates Christian enlistment in the IDF and a more distinct societal separation of Christians from Muslims. This separation is partly based on the purported fact that Christians in Israel are not technically Arabs, seeing as they were present in the Holy Land long before the Arab conquest, hallmarked by the Siege of Jerusalem. This distinction is in the process of being formalized into law, as the Likud government is currently drafting legislation to grant this request.

    This new attitude is founded largely by the perception by some that only in Israel the Christian population is growing due to natural increase and no state persecution, seeing the entire Middle East, except Lebanon, as where Christianity is and has been rapidly on the decline. In addition, increasing numbers of Christian leaders and community members are pointing to Muslim violence as a threat to their way of life in Arab majority cities and towns."




    Jewish Rabbis are protecting and helping persecuted Christians:

    Orthodox Rabbis founded charity fundraising initiative Blessing Bethlehem, which aim to aid the persecuted Christian community of Bethlehem,
    in part, and the larger persecuted Christian community of the Middle East region and throughout the world.


    In 2008, Rabbi Shlomo Riskin, the chief rabbi of Efrat, established the Center for Jewish–Christian Understanding and Cooperation or CJCUC, the first Orthodox Jewish institution to dialogue with the Christian world on a religious and theological basis. The center, currently located in Jerusalem, engages in Hebraic Bible Study for Christians, from both the local community and from abroad, has organized numerous interfaith praise initiatives, such as Day to Praise, and has established many fund-raising initiatives such as Blessing Bethlehem which aim to aid the persecuted Christian community of Bethlehem, in part, and the larger persecuted Christian community of the Middle East region and throughout the world.


    Christian party encourages full integration of Arabophone Christians into Israeli society, the two-state solution, and enlistment of Arab speaking Christians into the Israel Defense Forces.



    Christians leaving mixed Christian-Muslim towns for Jewish areas:

    The party's founder, Bishara Shilyan, said he wants to build a 30.5-metre (100 ft) tall statue of Jesus (modelled on Rio de Janeiro's Christ the Redeemer statue) on top of a mountain in Nazareth. He said the purpose of the statue would be to prevent Nazareth's Christian heritage from being eroded. The town's Christian population has been steadily decreasing relative to its Muslim population, with Christian residents leaving to the predominately Jewish cities of Nazareth Illit, Shfar'am, and Haifa.



    Christians are persecuted in Israel, you say? What an insult to the Christians of Egypt, Iraq, Syria and Palestinian territories, who are literally being genocided as we speak.
    @Jo I hope you are charging this mischiefmaker and his likes for their adverts. Or is it free adverts or brobaghanda for their occupation entity?

    @Ice Tea you didnt reply to my other post.
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    @Jo I hope you are charging this mischiefmaker and his likes for their adverts. Or is it free adverts or brobaghanda for their occupation entity?

    @Ice Tea you didnt reply to my other post.

    Typical. Now that I proved Christians are not only safe but prosperous and becoming even more integrated into Israeli society and you're out of arguments, it becomes 'propanda'. Lol

    What other post?
     
    Rafidi

    Rafidi

    Legendary Member
    What would that be? Nothing in there contradicts the Bible.
    Well, the bad news is there is something or even two big things that contradict the Bible and the biblical claim Zionists would use to lay claim to Palestine. You cant eat your cake and have it. And from the way you sound, you already knew it.

    You say God promised Abraham and his descendants the land. Abraham was from elsewhere and God made a promise to Him about a land somewhere. This goes to show that not all Israelites, and by extension Jews, could have been descendants of Abraham, Ishmael and Isaac, if all or most Jews descended from Canaanites as you pointed out through that Wiki narration. And if they didnt descend from Canaanites, then Abraham all the same was a migrant. You can't claim to be promised the land through Abraham and still be able to claim originality to the land from Canaanites. and if you insist, then you are just like everyone else, and here I am assuming for argument sake all White European Judaists who came to Palestine after the holocaust actually had ancestry in Palestine some 2000 or more years before. Ya3neh matra7 ma khreet shana2ook.

    Another problem. If you are laying claim through originality to the land, then Arabians, especially Yemenite tribes like the Himyarites trace their descent to Qahtan, who's a descendant of Shem, through Eber. Eber was believed to be the ancestors of the Hebrews. So the Arabians are semites. If you want to tell me Israelites were Canaanite followers of Abraham and his children, then the bulk of Israelites are not semites. Canaan was a son of Ham and not of Shem. So you are Hamites. So stop talking about antisemitism. Talk about antihamitism. And allow the Arabians to go to the promised land, since the promised land was to Shem and not to Ham according to the Bible.

    You see how you tie yourselves because you are lost in inventing lies to justify your crimes in Palestine?
     
    Last edited:
    NewLeb

    NewLeb

    New Member
    Iran doesnt get your support, if at all you are a Muslim, because of sectarian jealousy.
    Er, no. They don’t get my support because Iran has a tendency of always pushing above their weight, and acting like they are more than what they really are.

    They are arrogant and are more interested in proving to the world something about themselves, than tackling the actual mission at hand. They don’t care about Palestine as much as they care about stroking their egos....

    They are unprofessional bozos who regularly photoshop their great “scientific discoveries.” More so, they are entirely broke and have to beg to polytheistic peasants (like the Chinese) to aid them.

    Our sectarian division is the biggest curse that has afflicted us as Muslims. It is killing us. Otherwise, with its growth, despite decades of sanctions and isolations, Iran has proven that we can be great again. And we can be great again whether America, Russia, and China and Israehell like it or not. That means even if all the supreme non Muslim powers gather to weaken us, we can be great again if we unite. All it needs is for those cowards in the Gulf to put Muslims and their people first and stop being cowards. They're throwing away billions of dollars to buy Americans weapons that they dont really need. The US end up robbing them of both the oil and their petroleum dollars. Senseless!!! The Arabs and Persians have coexisted for centuries before America was born. The greatest scholars in Sunni Islam were Persian. So the rivalry is this sense of sectarian rivalry, which we can stop. It isnt even ethnic, except if you want to tell me that Americans are descendants of Yemeni or Arabian clans and the Iranians are not. For God's sake, there are even Iranian Arabs. The unity of Iran and the rest of the Muslim world is an Islamic obligation and an Islamic necessity. Otherwise, Muslims, all Muslims would continue to struggle.
    So you want to put an end to sectarianism, but in the same breath call the Gulf Arabs cowards for choose a different path than Iran? Nonsense.

    And who cares if the greatest Sunni scholars were Persian? American or Iranian, all humans descend from one man... or did you forget that? ;)
     
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