can the hatred directed towards Gebran Bassil be rationalized?

Dark Angel

Dark Angel

Legendary Member
i think this is one of the most fundamental questions that need to be asked at this moment in time, why do some people hate bassil with such a vengeance, and can their hatred be rationalized? or to the contrary, this kind of unsubstantiated hatred condemns its perpetrators rather than the person it is directed at.

in many instances i tried to approach the subject rationally with some supposedly educated people, and was a bit dismayed to what i found underneath that thin layer of appearances; a mix of naivety and evil, which i have to admit form a combination that i once used to think of as quite rare.

so i am therefore curious to understand from our own forum members, by providing the appropriate arguments, why they direct their anger towards GB and why are they seeking to punish him, almost exclusively, in the upcoming elections?
 
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  • NewLeb

    NewLeb

    New Member
    Like the quintessential Aouni, he’s obviously well-educated and did his homework. He crossed his “ts” and dotted his “is”... he’d make mama proud.

    But like most Aounies, he doesn’t have that “street smarts” appeal, and is generally lacking in confidence (he’s not charismatic). This manifest sometimes as arrogance, which explains why some of his moves backfire on him.
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    Existing? People are very, very concerned with FPM's internal elections and leadership disputes.
    elaborate, i didn't get what you want to say. i am just curious to figure out why he has become the subject of so much hatred.

    obviously his crimes and his guilt should surpass all others for him to be at the receiving end of such hatred. this topic actually deserves a thread of its own.

    i think this discussion is more suited to this thread
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    Like the quintessential Aouni, he’s obviously well-educated and did his homework. He crossed his “ts” and dotted his “is”... he’d make mama proud.

    But like most Aounies, he doesn’t have that “street smarts” appeal, and is generally lacking in confidence (he’s not charismatic). This manifest sometimes as arrogance, which explains why some of his moves backfire on him.
    are you talking about bassil the minister or bassil the head of fpm? or are you talking abt @Dark Angel ?
     
    AtheistForYeezus

    AtheistForYeezus

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    A better question would be: can some people's obsession with Gibran be rationalized? What is it that FPMers see in Gibran that others don't? What did he achieve during his tenure?
     
    Abou Sandal

    Abou Sandal

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    A better question would be: can some people's obsession with Gibran be rationalized? What is it that FPMers see in Gibran that others don't? What did he achieve during his tenure?
    Well for a start, he certainly did not "achieve" any of what his detractors accuse him of.
     
    Abou Sandal

    Abou Sandal

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    And the best answer was still in this post made by our esteemed friend @Viral

    Since you're asking…


    He is not a warlord who killed the Lebanese people from all sects including his own.

    He doesn’t own local militias financed by foreign countries.

    He doesn’t take orders from embassies neither does he ask them to help him starve and destroy people’s lives in his country.

    He does not belong to the mafia club that destroyed the country for 15 years civil war then looted its wealth for the following 30 years and used BDL as their proxy and kept it in the dark all those years.

    He did not invite and begged the Syrians and Israelis to invade Lebanon and humiliate its people.

    He did not commit massacres against innocent women and children.

    He did not assassinate Lebanon's army personnel, political figures and murdered their families and little children in their homes.

    He is not a divisive figure that promotes hatred among sects.

    He supported the resistance with dignity and his head held high.

    He disclosed all his finances voluntarily to the public and asked others to do the same.

    He insisted on forensic audits and took the initiative to make Berri get the message loud and clear.

    He dared calling Berri Baltagi

    He dared saying NO to Pompeo for Lebanon’s role in the deal of the century by refusing the bribe and reward that would guarantee him the next Presidency as GMA did before him and didn’t mind paying the price of exile.

    He insisted on negotiating with the Syrian authorities for the return of 1.5 million refugees.

    He opposed the will of the whole world by rejecting the Palestinians naturalization.

    He insisted on exploring and protecting Lebanon’s oil and gas resources

    He is honest, educated, dynamic and super smart.

    And above it all, his father in-law is GMA and refuses to betray him. How can you forgive him for all those crimes?



    See, by now, if we have to ask them your question we already know in advance we are addressing low life crawling traitors or complete morons.

    Traitors you can’t help; it is a genetic disease but morons might be able to wake up if they get hungry enough in time before they pass out…
     
    NewLeb

    NewLeb

    New Member
    are you talking about bassil the minister or bassil the head of fpm? or are you talking abt @Dark Angel ?
    Honestly, it could be both. It could even be you!

    Mr. Bassil represents you guys, and the reason this is so is because of the very similar characteristics and idiosyncrasies that Aounies (as a ethno-sectarian Lebanese group) express individually on a physical and mental capacity.
     
    JustLeb

    JustLeb

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    i think this is one of the most fundamental questions that need to be asked at this moment in time, why do some people hate bassil with such a vengeance, and can their hatred be rationalized? or to the contrary, this kind of unsubstantiated hatred condemns its perpetrators rather than the person it is directed at.

    in many instances i tried to approach the subject rationally with some supposedly educated people, and was a bit dismayed to what i found underneath that thin layer of appearances; a mix of naivety and evil, which i have to admit form a combination that i once used to think of as quite rare.

    so i am therefore curious to understand from our own forum members, by providing the appropriate arguments, why they direct their anger towards GB and why are they seeking to punish him, almost exclusively, in the upcoming elections?
    if you are happy of the situation the country has reached during the rule of bassil & 3ammo...So be it
    I am not happy, and I have told you in august 2015 that this man is a pathological liar
    I also drew the parallel between FPM and kataeb in the 80s (if you still remember it)
    كتائب: مش عم يخلو يشتغل للريس أمين
    تيار: ما خلونا نشتغل

    Bassil: FPM is the first party to make elections from the base
    Fact: elections never happened at the president level, and the one that happened for regional mounasi2i have be overturned by appointments.

    The history of electricity from 2008 til now and how bassil told Maguy Farah that power ships is a lie, then he brought them...
    The dams that are full of problems, msayl7a, bal3a etc...

    FPM attacked Riad Salameh for years for its bad management of the country financials
    when they had the occasion to replace him, they extended his mandate, apparently because of the "cedrus bank" ....

    if you are happy with this you are free, but personally I am not.
    I consider this guy to be evil and a catastrophe to the country, at the same level of Berri & Jomblat and the others...
     
    Dark Angel

    Dark Angel

    Legendary Member
    i will use your post as a case study to highlight a bit of what i find to be wrong, if you do not mind. it is not the content as much as it is the methodology, in other words it is not the ideas you are forwarding i have issues with as much as it is the broken minds and sick souls they are coming from.
    if you are happy of the situation the country has reached during the rule of bassil & 3ammo...So be it
    • the president has the least power in our system in comparison to the prime minister and the parliament speaker.
    • how is bassil ruling when he cannot get a single project to pass through without fighting for it for years?
    • why do you assume i am happy with the situation in the country?
    • why should my unhappiness with the situation in the country translate automatically into hatred towards "bassil w 3ammo" instead of being directed towards people who are actively responsible for the dire situation we are in, and are still working to mess up the situation on all levels and for everyone?
    I am not happy, and I have told you in august 2015 that this man is a pathological liar
    • how did you come to the conclusion he is a pathological liar?
    • based on what?
    • state some of the things he lied about to establish the pathology.
    I also drew the parallel between FPM and kataeb in the 80s (if you still remember it)
    كتائب: مش عم يخلو يشتغل للريس أمين
    تيار: ما خلونا نشتغل
    • how can you make such a conclusion and draw such parallels when during amin gemayel presidency the president had absolute power while during GMA's presidency the president is mostly like a POBox?
    • do you consider someone with such a deeply flawed thinking ability fit to even vote and determine our future?
    • what is it that makes you divorce reality and go straight towards making such deeply flawed and erroneous statements? this is the part i am interested in. is this not the most irrational and destructive of all approaches?
    Bassil: FPM is the first party to make elections from the base
    Fact: elections never happened at the president level, and the one that happened for regional mounasi2i have be overturned by appointments.
    this is why you hate bassil in a country ruled by criminals, thieves, and mafia lords? because an internal election was botched for all kinds of reasons?
    and the election happened, the opposition, probably yourself included, withdrew because they were cowards and sore losers.

    The history of electricity from 2008 til now and how bassil told Maguy Farah that power ships is a lie, then he brought them...
    The dams that are full of problems, msayl7a, bal3a etc...
    • how are the power ships a lie?
    • how did he say the power ships are a lie when the project was presented in the government by FPM two years prior to bringing the ships in, and took plenty of fighting to accomplish this much.
    • and what exactly is the history of the electricity? is it not the history of the cartels sabotaging the efforts every step of the way? you have no issues with the cartels it seems? or do you really think that the snake paula ya3qoubian and the clown hicham haddad will succeed where FPM has failed? this is where we usually encounter cheap slogans like "give them a chance and let's see"
    • and how can you claim the dams are full of problems when they obviously are not?
    FPM attacked Riad Salameh for years for its bad management of the country financials
    when they had the occasion to replace him, they extended his mandate, apparently because of the "cedrus bank" ....
    • why are you so sure FPM had the opportunity to replace salame?
    • do you know how is the governor of the central bank appointed?
    • was there any alternatives to saleme ready to be appointed in case he was decommissioned? are there any now?
    • don't you know it requires a majority of the government to be able to appoint a new governor for BDL?
    • dont you know it took more than 10 years to finally appoint deputies for the central bank's governor?
    if you are happy with this you are free, but personally I am not.
    again based on what assumption do you postulate that i could be happy with this shitty situation?
    and why not being happy necessitates directing my hatred towards bassil and GMA?
    why should i direct my anger towards the two people seemingly trying to do things right?

    I consider this guy to be evil and a catastrophe to the country, at the same level of Berri & Jomblat and the others...
    so basically you equate between murderers, ethnic cleansers, corrupt people who have been sucking the blood of the Lebanese for more than 50 years, with someone who known to be peaceful, no blood on his hands, no proof of corruption against him, etc.. and then you wonder why we are in this shitty situation? maybe because of this shitty mentality that does not discern right from wrong, and equates good people with evil ones.

    and more importantly, how do you think the situation will get better by removing bassil from the picture? eh byefrmouk farm inta w sliltak.
    this is precisely the kind of idiotic and hateful arguments that leave me mesmerized and baffled. you are blinded by hatred, literally to the point of becoming suicidal.
     
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    lebnan_lilkel

    lebnan_lilkel

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    He proved that in the current Lebanese sectarian system , you can't do anything different to everyone else. You run your party like a dictator . Deal with corrupt people in return for support..

    You have to ally with rich corrupt drug dealers like Sarkis Sarkis and run a sectarian and racist speach the likes that make the LF proud, to win elections .

    Apart from that, his sexist behaviour around females is creepy. Although that has improved.

    FPM is very dependent on ex armed forces as a support base. Gebran will never please them. it's the story of many Lebanese leaders. That is a factor. In third world countries this support seems critical. Many generals become presidents.
     
    V

    Viral

    Member
    if you are happy of the situation the country has reached during the rule of bassil & 3ammo...So be it
    Don’t you think this argument is getting a little old?
    I didn’t bother reading the rest of your post so feel free to do the same with mine.
    Regardless of how you feel about Hezbollah, I can spoon feed those who are easily misled by such political statements that serve precisely the corrupt political class in the country by saying this: Blaming Bassil for failing to stop the extremely well and deeply establish mafias in Lebanon is like blaming the Hariris and Saniora for failing to disarm Hezbollah for all those years let alone allowing them becoming stronger than ever since 2006. Or even blaming Israel for that...
    I don’t see anyone blaming Hariri or accusing him of failing in that regard.
    The other example I can give is a scene we’ve witnessed over decade on Lebanon streets especially during the civil war when armed militias from all sides including PLO who used to pass by traffic cops at cross roads on duty trying to do their job guiding traffic (daraki) without even paying attention to them if not shooting at them. If you really want law and order in such lawless environment, would you blame the cop and fire him or would you support him and rise against the mafias and illegal.
    Make sure which side you’re asking the question, the good people or the mafias…
    Sadly, many of us are still failing to see through this insult to our intelligence.
     
    Dark Angel

    Dark Angel

    Legendary Member
    He proved that in the current Lebanese sectarian system , you can't do anything different to everyone else.
    despite the poor formulation of the idea you are trying to express, i have to say no.

    bassil, FPM, and many others proved that even if you do things differently in this system it will not necessarily yield any results, because our system is crippled and the junctions of power are controlled by specific people that cannot be overpassed.

    You run your party like a dictator . Deal with corrupt people in return for support, You have to ally with rich corrupt drug dealers like Sarkis Sarkis
    this unfortunately is only partially true. FPM had to ally with many corrupt people, including mr slaymen franjieh and work closely with them hoping that change could be implemented this way. unfortunately that was not a successful endeavor and did not lead to positive results.

    the reason why i am bringing slaymen franjieh as an example is because i think you are one of his followers if memory serves me right. you turned against FPM when franjieh fell out of favor with GMA, and prior to that you were quite a strong defender of GMA and FPM. now it goes without saying that corrupt people like frangieh would not even be a problem had people like yourself been able to make better choices and act like free and honorable men. however i do not blame you, i know you are the victim of your own environment, the key idea is not simply that you can change that, but also that you should change that, unless you do not mind the web of interests that ties franjieh to the zaydan cartel and to the rahmeh cartel, and of course, assuming no citizen with dignity likes to be treated as such:

    how many people do you think would still be in FPM if bassil ever acted this way with anyone, let alone with supporters?

    and run a sectarian and racist speach the likes that make the LF proud, to win elections .
    sectarian and racist?
    to reestablish the Christian presence in the state is sectarian??
    to warn that our economy will collapse under the weight of the syrian refugees is racist? shame on you.
    bassil was the only person with enough courage to approach these subjects and warn the Lebanese of the dire consequences. we have so far suffered an estimated 45 billion USD of direct and indirect losses to our economy because of the refugees crisis.
    shame on you indeed, instead of having the courage to bring witness to the truth and support him on this crucial point, you accuse him of racism? what sort of men are our mothers giving birth to in Lebanon? what sort of men are graduating from our colleges and universities?

    Apart from that, his sexist behaviour around females is creepy. Although that has improved.
    why on earth would anyone make such a statement? sexist behavior around females? yet another evidence to the irrational state that governs your sentiment towards bassil.

    FPM is very dependent on ex armed forces as a support base. Gebran will never please them. it's the story of many Lebanese leaders. That is a factor. In third world countries this support seems critical. Many generals become presidents.
    again, the plagues in your chain of thoughts....
    FPM is dependent on patriots as a support base, most veterans are very patriotic, therefore most of them end up supporting FPM's choices.

    honestly, what has happened to the people able of conducting critical thinking and making the right choices? the Lebanese seem to be turning into walking zombies..
     
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    lebnan_lilkel

    lebnan_lilkel

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    despite the poor formulation of the idea you are trying to express, i have to say no.

    bassil, FPM, and many others proved that even if you do things differently in this system it will not necessarily yield any results, because our system is crippled and the junctions of power are controlled by specific people that cannot be overpassed.
    So you agree ..same old same old.. putting lipstick on a pig doesn't make it any different.

    this unfortunately is only partially true. FPM had to ally with many corrupt people, including mr slaymen franjieh and work closely with them hoping that change could be implemented this way. unfortunately that was not a successful endeavor and did not lead to positive results.

    the reason why i am bringing slaymen franjieh as an example is because i think you are one of his followers if memory serves me right. you turned against FPM when franjieh fell out of favor with GMA, and prior to that you were quite a strong defender of GMA and FPM. now it goes without saying that corrupt people like frangieh would not even be a problem had people like yourself been able to make better choice sand act like free and honorable men. however i do not blame you, i know you are the victim of your own environment, the key idea is not simply that you can change that, but also that you should change that, unless you do not mind the web of interests that ties franjieh to the zaydan cartel and to the rahmeh cartel, and of course, assuming no citizen with dignity likes to be treated as such:
    You are right. I was amused about the time when you left Sleiman Frangieh and only supported FPM up to a certain point. The guys in this forum turned on Zghartawi and Bsharraniyi making fun of them as people . The racism is not limited to the angels. It cheesed me off because it proved that Franjieh follower were right. We only have each other. That is spot on. I was saved by his followers once out of a fight with SSNP and will not turn for the sake of of pretenders. These days I dont mind Geagea too.

    [/QUOTE]


    how many people do you think would still be in FPM if bassil ever acted this way with anyone, let alone with supporters?


    sectarian and racist?
    to warn that our economy will collapse under the weight of the syrian refugees is sectarian and racist? shame on you. bassil was the only person with enough courage to approach this subject and warn the Lebanese of the dire consequences. we have so far suffered an estimated 45 billion USD of direct and indirect losses to our economy because of the refugees crisis.
    shame on you indeed, instead of having the courage to bring witness to the truth and support him on this crucial point, you accuse him of racism? what sort of men are our mothers giving birth to in Lebanon? what sort of men are graduating from our colleges and universities?
    Nehna almasihiyi ! are not racist .. I dont want the syrians here more than anyone but dont see any heroics in what he did. They need ships to sail to europe. He prefers to please europeans to become president.

    why on earth would anyone make such a statement? sexist behavior around females? yet another evidence to the irrational state that governs the sentiment towards bassil.

    again, the plagues in your chain of thoughts....
    FPM is dependent on patriots as a support base, most veterans are very patriotic, therefore most of them end up supporting FPM's choices.

    honestly, what has happened to the people able of conducting critical thinking and making the right choices? the Lebanese seem to be turning into walking zombies..
    I base his behaviour on my experience. not your mumbo jumbo..
     
    Dark Angel

    Dark Angel

    Legendary Member
    So you agree ..same old same old.. putting lipstick on a pig doesn't make it any different.



    You are right. I was amused about the time when you left Sleiman Frangieh and only supported FPM up to a certain point. The guys in this forum turned on Zghartawi and Bsharraniyi making fun of them as people . The racism is not limited to the angels. It cheesed me off because it proved that Franjieh follower were right. We only have each other. That is spot on. I was saved by his followers once out of a fight with SSNP and will not turn for the sake of of pretenders. These days I dont mind Geagea too.


    Nehna almasihiyi ! are not racist .. I dont want the syrians here more than anyone but dont see any heroics in what he did. They need ships to sail to europe. He prefers to please europeans to become president.



    I base his behaviour on my experience. not your mumbo jumbo..
    deep.. i rest my case.. at least with you.
     
    JustLeb

    JustLeb

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    جبران باسيل بدأ بإستنساخ اصناف جديدة من الخُضار




     
    V

    Viral

    Member
    Here is why Bassil has no friends in high places. He's no ones man.
    No wonder why they send their rabid dogs after him...


     
    lebnan_lilkel

    lebnan_lilkel

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Here is why Bassil has no friends in high places. He's no ones man.
    No wonder why they send their rabid dogs after him...


    All of them still have to work with the USA, France , Italy, KSA and to a lesser extent Syria. HA has taken on the Syrian Role. Nothing changed. Nothing can change with continued threats from all around us. So lets be truthful.
     
    JustLeb

    JustLeb

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    and more importantly, how do you think the situation will get better by removing bassil from the picture? eh byefrmouk farm inta w sliltak.
    I wanted to reply to each of your point, but changed my mind when I read the above.
    If you think Bassil mhadda 3amoud el sama, let it be...
    This is the kind of sheep thinking that makes the za3im a semi-god, is what will stop any kind of progress in the country ...
    By the way, this is not specific to you alone, but to all lebanese people, however at one period of time I thought FPM might be different
    This is exactly how the sunni will argue in favor of hariri, the druze will argue in favor of jomblat, the shiite will argue for Berri & Nasrallah
    Sorry dude I quit that thinking long ago, you want to stay there, it is your choice.


    this is precisely the kind of idiotic and hateful arguments that leave me mesmerized and baffled. you are blinded by hatred, literally to the point of becoming suicidal.
    I am with ROUKOZ :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
    1594603958950.png
     
    V

    Viral

    Member
    All of them still have to work with the USA, France , Italy, KSA and to a lesser extent Syria. HA has taken on the Syrian Role. Nothing changed. Nothing can change with continued threats from all around us. So lets be truthful.
    So where did Bassil go wrong?

    The change starts at home when we cripple those domestic hands acting on behalf of foreign governments by not voting for them rather rising against them and sending them to jail. The problem is our sectarian mentality that overrides our national interest. We bring outsiders to protect our religious tribes (naively thinking those foreigners care about our religion) and by doing so we destroy our country.

    I don’t blame foreign governments acting in their own best interest. I blame Lebanon for not doing the same let alone welcoming the rape of its people thought local traitors and warlords. The Lebanese attitude of worshipping foreigners got to change. Without knowing we became the laughing stock of the whole world including the Arabs living in the desert.

    Such an embarrassment to say the least…
     
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