Informational Deep Into Christianity

manifesto

Well-Known Member
@manifesto yes because when padre pio wants to buy his acid he instructs his relative to tell the pharmacist "hayda el acid la padre pio, w ana 2rabto lazam, bass 7lefo we7yet allah ma betkhabro 7ada" makes sense.
Evidence for the reality of stigmata, moreover, is sketchy at best; Father Herbert Thurston, the great Jesuit authority on the physical phenomena of mysticism, contended that there had been no completely believable case since that of St. Francis himself. Today, the Catholic church itself takes a cautious view of the phenomenon, accepting that miracles can indeed occur while declining to formally acknowledge even St. Francis’s stigmata as miraculous.

How, then to explain this phenomenon? Fraud certainly figures in some cases. Magdalena de la Cruz, the famous Spanish stigmatic of the 16th century whose frequent self-mortification and spectacular wounds made her a favorite at court, eventually confessed to having inflicted her own injuries. Similarly, Johann Jetzer, who claimed to have experienced not only recurrent poltergeist phenomena but also a series of religious visions, confessed in 1507 that his stigmata were fake. Four friars from his monastery were subsequently burned at the stake, and Jetzer himself escaped death only after his mother smuggled him a set of women’s clothes, in which he bluffed his way out of his death cell.

Aside from cases of outright fraud, which may well form the majority of all cases, the appearance of stigmata appears to be an essentially psychological condition whose manifestations are determined by the cultural expectations of the stigmatics themselves. A large number of sufferers seem to have displayed abundant evidence of low self-esteem, health problems, or a tendency toward self-mutilation - a potent mix when combined with exposure to the pervasive iconography of centuries of Christian tradition. It has been shown beyond a reasonable doubt that many have inflicted the five wounds on themselves, sometimes unconsciously, perhaps while in an altered state of consciousness brought on by extensive fasting or intensive prayer.

Read more: The Mystery of the Five Wounds | History | Smithsonian
 
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  • Dark Angel

    Legendary Member
    @manifesto you now jumped to a different topic.

    from a logical argumentative perspective, there is a difference between arguing a specific instance is a fraud, and between arguing that frauds do exists. if frauds do exist, and they do, it doesn't make every single instance fraudulent.

    even if you subscribe to the psychological notion, it should make you realize that the power of the mind and the power of the thought does indeed extend beyond the limits of the physical world.

    this is an investigation by UCLA's antoine mansour testimony about investigating the peculiar case of a young woman named mirna in damascus experiencing stigmata and he is quite astonished about how the wounds completely heal within hours without leaving a trace.


    people are free to interpret this and its meaning as they wish.
     
    Says the guy who believes that a man is able to walk on water and raise people from the dead...LOL

    What brings you here? Did you a take a break from praying the rosary?
    As a memist yourself, what brought you here, a break from the wealth of meme information that you quench your brains thirst with?

    Memism: The belief that all true knowledge emanates from cute memes. If it cannot be expressed by a meme, it cannot be true.
     
    @Dark Angel You call it a miracle. Those in the know call it spontaneous regression. It's not uncommon for some cancers to suddenly vanish without medical treatment. Rare, but not uncommon. Sometimes an infection can increase the efficacy of the immune system.

    In the case of Nuhad el Chami, the woman with partial paralysis, who said that paralysis due to a stroke can't heal with time?

    By the way, had St. Charbel been such a great surgeon he wouldn't have left her a scar on her neck the size of of a volcano crater LOL. Where did he graduate from?
    Any memes to prove your claim?
     
    Would you explain what that means and why you keep replying to DJ with it?
    In short: DJ has been around since 2014 (check earlier pages of the thread), and we were discussing with him, yet, eventually his entire premise could be summarized in two points: a) This verse and b) That the Church killed Giordano Bruno (and anything uttered by Hitchens). He disappeared for years, came back and his posts were exactly the same. As such, I am simply replying in kind with something close to his heart.
     

    SeaAb

    Well-Known Member
    Staff member
    In short: DJ has been around since 2014 (check earlier pages of the thread), and we were discussing with him, yet, eventually his entire premise could be summarized in two points: a) This verse and b) That the Church killed Giordano Bruno (and anything uttered by Hitchens). He disappeared for years, came back and his posts were exactly the same. As such, I am simply replying in kind with something close to his heart.
    What does it actually mean though? Who is going to be thrown into the blazing furnace...? :)
     
    What does it actually mean though? Who is going to be thrown into the blazing furnace...? :)
    Everyone who is against Christ and his vicars on Earth, this is the vile way in which the authoritarian Church treats its people, including Giordano Bruno :)

    Also, these responses to DJ became a tradition, I somewhat forgot their roots.
     

    Indie

    Legendary Member
    Staff member
    What does it actually mean though? Who is going to be thrown into the blazing furnace...? :)
    Have you ever felt horribly guilty about something? Or made the wrong decisions and suffered the consequences? Have you ever been completely overwhelmed with regrets, or sadness, or bitterness? How did it feel inside?

    The blazing furnace is a metaphor...

    Watch the short Bishop Barron video on hell. It explains the topic well.
     
    Have you ever felt horribly guilty about something? Or made the wrong decisions and suffered the consequences? Have you ever been completely overwhelmed with regrets, or sadness, or bitterness? How did it feel inside?

    The blazing furnace is a metaphor...

    Watch the short Bishop Barron video on hell. It explains the topic well.
    I submit to you the entire bible is a metaphor, including the rising from the dead and flying to heaven bit, aka the resurrection. The shifting interpretations of the bible became a paradigm of Christianity's survival in modern times. This is not a bad thing, the more flexible and open to interpretation a religion becomes, the less harmful and benign. Take Islam as an example, it's like the Church about 400 years ago, intolerant of free thinking and expression. But even Islam is going through a seismic shift due to zeitgeist of the information age. What was taken literal in the past, becomes absurd in succeeding generations and is quickly relegated to the figurative interpretation. Don't be surprised one day if you look up and find the bible categorized in the fictional category. It's already happening in some places and would have been far more prevalent if not for sensitivities of the religious community. You have to be careful with the cult of God, sort of like weaning a child off santa clause...
     
    I submit to you the entire bible is a metaphor, including the rising from the dead and flying to heaven bit, aka the resurrection. The shifting interpretations of the bible became a paradigm of Christianity's survival in modern times. This is not a bad thing, the more flexible and open to interpretation a religion becomes, the less harmful and benign. Take Islam as an example, it's like the Church about 400 years ago, intolerant of free thinking and expression. But even Islam is going through a seismic shift due to zeitgeist of the information age. What was taken literal in the past, becomes absurd in succeeding generations and is quickly relegated to the figurative interpretation. Don't be surprised one day if you look up and find the bible categorized in the fictional category. It's already happening in some places and would have been far more prevalent if not for sensitivities of the religious community. You have to be careful with the cult of God, sort of like weaning a child off santa clause...
    Their prophet used to kill and he insisted that muslims should kill all etc how will they transform from that?!!!
     
    Their prophet used to kill and he insisted that muslims should kill all etc how will they transform from that?!!!
    Same way as Christianity evolved from its blood-soaked history. As in the Christian reformation, perpetual infighting weakens a religion by diminishing its centralization, which is exactly what's going on in Islam now. Unfortunately, there will be more suffering before things get better.
     
    Same way as Christianity evolved from its blood-soaked history. As in the Christian reformation, perpetual infighting weakens a religion by diminishing its centralization, which is exactly what's going on in Islam now. Unfortunately, there will be more suffering before things get better.
    Not the same way.. Jesus didnt teach us to kill jews or muslims or buddhists or hindus... its not the same...Yes Christians made huge mistakes and I as a Christian am ashamed of those mistakes but Muslims doctrine is the doctrine of the devil...
     
    Not the same way.. Jesus didnt teach us to kill jews or muslims or buddhists or hindus... its not the same...Yes Christians made huge mistakes and I as a Christian am ashamed of those mistakes but Muslims doctrine is the doctrine of the devil...
    I'll give you that Jesus wasn't an army general, but according to the bible he explicitly condemned non-believers (who did not believe he is the son of God) to an eternity of torment in hell. Due to this condemnation and other scripture in which he espouses slavery and the inequality of women, an unspeakable amount of violence were committed in his name throughout the history of Christendom.
     
    I'll give you that Jesus wasn't an army general, but according to the bible he explicitly condemned non-believers (who did not believe he is the son of God) to an eternity of torment in hell. Due to this condemnation and other scripture in which he espouses slavery and the inequality of women, an unspeakable amount of violence were committed in his name throughout the history of Christendom.
    Its not him.. dont mistake what we wrote for his actions... I know many priests told me the Church added things... You need to know Jesus was Pure Love... Thats what should be preached apart from Christianity or the Church...
     
    I'll give you that Jesus wasn't an army general, but according to the bible he explicitly condemned non-believers (who did not believe he is the son of God) to an eternity of torment in hell. Due to this condemnation and other scripture in which he espouses slavery and the inequality of women, an unspeakable amount of violence were committed in his name throughout the history of Christendom.
    Its not him.. dont mistake what we wrote for his actions... I know many priests told me the Church added things... You need to know Jesus was Pure Love... Thats what should be preached apart from Christianity or the Church...
    We don't seem to be getting it. Please enlighten us and explain how does condemning to hell those who would definitively espouse evil such as murder and slavery equate to espousing murder and slavery? Also, show us how is the Church's current (view and method of) Biblical interpretation inconsistently different from the earlier centuries and throughout the ages, as you are claiming, please show us how to arrive at such a conclusion in case we wanted to likewise enlighten others.