• Before posting an article from a specific source, check this list here to see how much the Orange Room trust it. You can also vote/change your vote based on the source track record.

Deep into judaism

Mighty Goat

Mighty Goat

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
Most Israelites are Jews, or came to be called so following Babylonian captivity. No theft occurring.
I do not think that this is true. Only Judeans are Jews. The Levites and the Judeans nowadays are called Jews, but the Levites are not Jews. Cohens are Levites. Levites are not Judeans. The others are the ten lost tribes. They were not really lost. We have Al Lawi, meaning Levite in Lebanon.

The Babylonians captured all the elite and administration from Judah and Israel and left behind those that worked the land.

In the Bible we have the house of Judah and the House of Israel. These are not the same people.

Judah separated from Israel. The Samaritans while Israelites, they are not Jews.
 
  • Advertisement
  • Silence

    Silence

    Well-Known Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    I've never met a Jew who professed to want Greater Israel, so I highly doubt that this person is Jewish.
    Abir is good in getting our curiosity.... so if not jew (which I believe too) she might be Druze which makes sense: Going back to Salomon, initiation stuff...and Israeli cousins
     
    Dirty Dragon

    Dirty Dragon

    Well-Known Member
    Abir is good in getting our curiosity.... so if not jew (which I believe too) she might be Druze which makes sense: Going back to Salomon, initiation stuff...and Israeli cousins
    We need a Deep into Druze thread :p
     
    Muki

    Muki

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Abir is good in getting our curiosity.... so if not jew (which I believe too) she might be Druze which makes sense: Going back to Salomon, initiation stuff...and Israeli cousins
    I have Druze friends with the last name Chaaban, from Lebanon, so that's what I'm assuming. Doesn't matter to me, anyways; if she wishes to share, she can. If not, I understand and won't push.
     
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    What would be the geographic borders of "Greater Israel" according to your vision?
    Who are the people that would inhabit it, among the peoples that exist today ?
    This is no image that is achieved by states. It is an image.

    Now we start, true no Zionist Jew believes in Greater Israel. An Israelite may believe in Greater Israel. Israelite and Jew are not mutually inclusive. The Kingdom of Judah seceded from the Kingdom of Israel after the death of Solomon.

    So, the Judeans are separatists. They are like the block Quebecois.

    The Israelites are pretty much Canadian.
     
    Dirty Dragon

    Dirty Dragon

    Well-Known Member
    This is no image that is achieved by states. It is an image.

    Now we start, true no Zionist Jew believes in Greater Israel. An Israelite may believe in Greater Israel. Israelite and Jew are not mutually inclusive. The Kingdom of Judah seceded from the Kingdom of Israel after the death of Solomon.

    So, the Judeans are separatists. They are like the block Quebecois.

    The Israelites are pretty much Canadian.
    So, you have no answer to couple simple questions ?
     
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    So, you have no answer to couple simple questions ?
    Ok, now I paid attention.

    The boundaries of Israel are from East to West and North to South of the Earth. Its citizens are the citizenry of the world. We should consider the Chinese in.
     
    Dirty Dragon

    Dirty Dragon

    Well-Known Member
    Man, this is called Initiation, you take what you are given, you cannot rush knowledge, it is a ritual here, not a discussion, be grateful...I am.
    Not a fan of initiation. Leaves too much room for one to steered. Each person takes in knowledge in their own way. So long as knowledge is unconditional, that should not be a problem.
     
    Dirty Dragon

    Dirty Dragon

    Well-Known Member
    Ok, now I paid attention.

    The boundaries of Israel are from East to West and North to South of the Earth. Its citizens are the citizenry of the world. We should consider the Chinese in.
    In that case, what differentiates the Israelites/Judeans from other citizens of the world like the Chinese ?
     
    Silence

    Silence

    Well-Known Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    the rest of the world....is the 10 lost tribes (it is a wild guess.... or may be a revelation)
     
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    In that case, what differentiates the Israelites/Judeans from other other citizens of the world like the Chinese ?
    If we want to take the theoretical idea of historical Israel. It was a kingdom that spread from East to West and North to South. In included in it as members of the citizenry not only this that believed, but also this that did not believe. It was not a kingdom for the Jews only.

    Judeans on the other hand are religious. They have a religious law. They govern by the law of God. This is like Muslims and Christians. Israelites do not believe that anyone can govern in the law of God after the death of David, Judeans do. This is similar to the Sunni Shii split. But in the case of the Israelites the Judeans are exterminating the existence of Israel as a separate entity from the kingdom of Judah.

    So, in essence this is the global dilemma, is there a man entitled to govern in the law of God after the death of David. This then becomes replicated with the death of Christ and the Death of Mohamed.
     
    Last edited:
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Looks like there is a Jewish Antoun Saadeh we were not aware of.
    Good observation. In fact, the Fertile Crescent of Saadeh has the same geographical boundaries of Zionist Greater Israel. I must stress that I do not speak of this geographical boundary. I speak of an image. The problem was not with Saadeh's vision.

    The Problem was with the Zionist Jews lack of vision. They denied that Israel was Hebrew and the Hebrews were not the Jews. They also denied the multiculturalism of the Fertile Crescent. They wanted a state that looks like these European states which emerged from 350 years of ethnic cleansing. They did not want the multi-cultural multi-ethnic Israel..
     
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    In that case, what differentiates the Israelites/Judeans from other citizens of the world like the Chinese ?
    Nothing separates the Israelites from citizenry. All citizens are Israelites. You need to think of Israel as a concept and not as an identity. This is the Israel outside this little political entity called the State of Israel. So, there is an Israel, a name God gave Jacob. Jacob had twelve sons. They are called the Israelites. They make the nations of the world. This means there is no difference between a Chinese and a Jew in Israel.
    It is a conceptual mind in which citizens are not defined by religious identity. Because Israel did not have a religion. I mean Israel was not Jewish. He was not Muslim and he was not Christian, and seriously had no religion.

    The Israelites share the Earth as one common Estate with no boundaries. This will not happen. Because it looks like there will be no war then, which is very unlikely to happen as long as we are human enough. Humanity is about killing each other just like the story of the loving brothers Abel and Cane, and more love arising with Joseph and his siblings. Poor Israel.

    When it comes to Judeans. They are the descendants of Judah. He is only one of the twelve sons. His descendants want to establish supremacy, like Quraish in Islam I guess.

    Judeans believe in their separation from the realm of the Kufar. The Kufar are these Israelites who believed in the Golden Calve. These are the Israelites that worshiped Baal. These are also the Israelites that allied with the Arabs. The Israelites were there upon Conquest. This is thanks to Lebanon still documented on these icons of our history that tell who were are at Ikhraj Kaid. So, there are Israelites that thank God still live in Lebanon. They are protected by the UNESCO, like we protect the temple from these Judeans.

    Multi-culturalism is what the Judeans dislike about Israel. They do not like Solomon, for he married Cannanite and Egyptian women and followed their idolatry. Things like this want them to separate. They are pure. They cannot mix with this impure, pleasureful, idol worshiper Israelites. The Judeans separate themselves from Israel and from the Israelites by the claim of purity of their religion from idolatry practiced by the Israelites.

    An Israelite is a free wo/man with no religion, a citizen of the world.
     
    Muki

    Muki

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Good observation. In fact, the Fertile Crescent of Saadeh has the same geographical boundaries of Zionist Greater Israel. I must stress that I do not speak of this geographical boundary. I speak of an image. The problem was not with Saadeh's vision.

    The Problem was with the Zionist Jews lack of vision. They denied that Israel was Hebrew and the Hebrews were not the Jews. They also denied the multiculturalism of the Fertile Crescent. They wanted a state that looks like these European states which emerged from 350 years of ethnic cleansing. They did not want the multi-cultural multi-ethnic Israel..
    I don't know how anyone can look at the contemporary geopolitical map of the Middle East, and still utter the above. Islam is not a religion only, it's a political ideology and its adherents will always fight those that do not subscribe to their vision. You want to nudge these inside Israel and give them power? In your dreams. Israel is the only country in the middle east where any religion can be practiced freely, and where you are not imprisoned, harassed, or murdered for being a different religion. Good enough for me, though there is much room for improvement.
     
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    I don't know how anyone can look at the contemporary geopolitical map of the Middle East, and still utter the above. Islam is not a religion only, it's a political ideology and its adherents will always fight those that do not subscribe to their vision. You want to nudge these inside Israel and give them power? In your dreams. Israel is the only country in the middle east where any religion can be practiced freely, and where you are not imprisoned, harassed, or murdered for being a different religion. Good enough for me, though there is much room for improvement.
    Then what is the fuss you are making about the Jewish majority and the Jewish tyranny. Take them Palestinians as citizens of Israel, after all you called it Israel because it included non Jews, like the Druze, Christians and Muslims.

    You are mistaken when you say that freedom may be attained in a state that wishes to maintain a form of tyranny it called democracy of the religious majority that thinks it is a nation. Yes, you have a state. true, someone who is looking at the map of the region today may not ever think that any state including little Israel will stay the way it looks like now.

    Enlightenment is coming. History says it is cyclical. It comes to this that lives in darkness.

    You may choose to join the minority today, the would certainly make the majority of tomorrow.
     
    Muki

    Muki

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Then what is the fuss you are making about the Jewish majority and the Jewish tyranny. Take them Palestinians as citizens of Israel, after all you called it Israel because it included non Jews, like the Druze, Christians and Muslims.

    You are mistaken when you say that freedom may be attained in a state that wishes to maintain a form of tyranny it called democracy of the religious majority that thinks it is a nation. Yes, you have a state. true, someone who is looking at the map of the region today may not ever think that any state including little Israel will stay the way it looks like now.

    Enlightenment is coming. History says it is cyclical. It comes to this that lives in darkness.

    You may choose to join the minority today, the would certainly make the majority of tomorrow.
    Why would Israel take foreigners as its citizens?

    Let Lebanese make the Syrians of 1948 and 2011-present as its citizens.

    You say tyranny and oppression, yet one stroll through Arab villages in Israel will prove just how wrong you are. They live in better housing than Jews do.
     
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Why would Israel take foreigners as its citizens?

    Let Lebanese make the Syrians of 1948 and 2011-present as its citizens.

    You say tyranny and oppression, yet one stroll through Arab villages in Israel will prove just how wrong you are. They live in better housing than Jews do.
    This was their property and they kept it, so where is the problem.
     
    Top