Feedback Defining the orange room

Jo

Jo

Administrator
Master Penguin
In a new survey released a couple of weeks ago, 75% of respondents agree that the integrity of sites like Facebook and Twitter have diminished, and 80% trust responses in forums more than those on Facebook. (source)

That being said, this year, I would like to work with your help on improving this community, its political debate and hoping to have a small tiny effect on the overall Lebanese political debate scene.

Keeping the above in mind, the Orange Room is now defined by 3 pillars (open for amendment and suggestions)

1) Identity

As most of you noticed, we have a new logo now, forum structure, fewer ads (that i intend to remove completely) and a clearer statement. (Promoting free thoughtful dialogue).
The structure is there and we are still moving old topics to their respective section. What do you think about it? If you want to help to move those nasty topics, let me know and I can give you the needed privileges.
The ads, well they just look shitty, I decided to finance the forum myself with the help of donations/account upgrades.

2) Reputation

The reputation of the community is actually the reputation of its members. No matter how many rules we create and how many moderators stay online to implement them, if the members do not realize that insulting religion, religious figures do not really lead to anything and just overall adds negativity to the actual topic that there is nothing moderators can do.
Every subject, law, decree, decision in Lebanon is directly affected and can be associated with Religion. That's just the nature of our country and sadly it won't change anytime soon.
So, i need your help here guys, what should be done to improve the discussions? while at the same time minimizing moderators actions. Or maybe are we just doomed till eternity to debate our religious differences?

3) Incentive

The idea here is to give incentive to members with the most valuable contributions (like @TayyarBeino for example in the SCW thread). Any suggestions here?

Thanks
Jo
 
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  • Le منشار

    Le منشار

    New Member
    1 - start with your avatar because it's disturbing unless you mean:

    2 - a Dark Mode for the forum to help with eye strain, this is a very important matter. (may double the number of visitors)
     
    Last edited:
    J

    joseph_lubnan

    Legendary Member
    In a new survey released a couple of weeks ago, 75% of respondents agree that the integrity of sites like Facebook and Twitter have diminished, and 80% trust responses in forums more than those on Facebook. (source)

    That being said, this year, I would like to work with your help on improving this community, its political debate and hoping to have a small tiny effect on the overall Lebanese political debate scene.

    Keeping the above in mind, the Orange Room is now defined by 3 pillars (open for amendment and suggestions)

    1) Identity

    As most of you noticed, we have a new logo now, forum structure, fewer ads (that i intend to remove completely) and a clearer statement. (Promoting free thoughtful dialogue).
    The structure is there and we are still moving old topics to their respective section. What do you think about it? If you want to help to move those nasty topics, let me know and I can give you the needed privileges.
    The ads, well they just look shitty, I decided to finance the forum myself with the help of donations/account upgrades.

    2) Reputation

    The reputation of the community is actually the reputation of its members. No matter how many rules we create and how many moderators stay online to implement them, if the members do not realize that insulting religion, religious figures do not really lead to anything and just overall adds negativity to the actual topic that there is nothing moderators can do.
    Every subject, law, decree, decision in Lebanon is directly affected and can be associated with Religion. That's just the nature of our country and sadly it won't change anytime soon.
    So, i need your help here guys, what should be done to improve the discussions? while at the same time minimizing moderators actions. Or maybe are we just doomed till eternity to debate our religious differences?

    3) Incentive

    The idea here is to give incentive to members with the most valuable contributions (like @TayyarBeino for example in the SCW thread). Any suggestions here?

    Thanks
    Jo
    There are two most important elements in allowing a discussion forum like this one to thrive and they are both related to not curbing free expression.

    1. You cannot simply allow any moderator the freedom to define something as "trolling" and deleting with the stroke of a key. What people write is their opinions and views and unless they are using profanity and personal insults, their opinions should not be suppressed arbitrarily. When someone writes something they need to be sure no one can arbitrarily delete it.

    2. You cannot have a forum that appears biased by its brand. Calling this an Orange Room makes it inherently biased to FPM.
     
    J

    joseph_lubnan

    Legendary Member
    That's a miss conception. No one has the monopoly on the color Orange.

    What about Our local offices | Orange Business Services ? are they also biased by their brand?
    You cannot deny that the history of this forum being LFPM forum, to its adoption by tayyar.org, and thereafter its transformation to none other than an "orange" room, makes the Orange brand for the forum an indication of bias. The brand should instill confidence that this is an independent forum that protects freedom of expression.

    This is my opinion, assuming you have the ambition of taking this to another level and transcending its origins. Something to think about, though I understand it is not an easy thing.
     
    Jo

    Jo

    Administrator
    Master Penguin
    You cannot deny that the history of this forum being LFPM forum, to its adoption by tayyar.org, and thereafter its transformation to none other than an "orange" room, makes the Orange brand for the forum an indication of bias. The brand should instill confidence that this is an independent forum that protects freedom of expression.
    Sadly the name cannot be changed.
     
    Dark Angel

    Dark Angel

    Legendary Member
    So, i need your help here guys, what should be done to improve the discussions? ...
    the first ailment this forum is suffering from is trolling. there is a new breed of users that takes nothing seriously and respects nothing, a couple of jokes is one thing, an established pattern of intentional trolling is something else all together, and will simply sabotage every discussion. there should be safeguards against that. additionally, the LVV/sadek2010 style of meaningless and nonstop feuds are pretty disturbing, there should also be safeguards against that.
     
    J

    joseph_lubnan

    Legendary Member
    Sadly the name cannot be changed.
    I am sure it can. It is just something that is not easy to do, because you lose existing brand equity. What I am trying to tell you is the current brand equity expresses inherent bias and goes against your professed aims for this discussion space. Sure like i said not an easy decision at all.
     
    J

    joseph_lubnan

    Legendary Member
    the first ailment this forum is suffering from is trolling. there is a new breed of users that takes nothing seriously and respects nothing, a couple of jokes is one thing, an established pattern of intentional trolling is something else all together, and will simply sabotage every discussion. there should be safeguards against that. additionally, the LVV/sadek2010 style of meaningless and nonstop feuds are pretty disturbing, there should also be safeguards against that.
    allowing moderators to define trolling is a slippery slope. The very definition of trolling is subjective. If you want a forum that protects freedom of expression, the only thing you delete is profanity and personal insults. I have had recent posts deleted under the pretext of "deep trolling" or something like that, which is entirely unacceptable and who the hell defines what "deep trolling" is?
     
    Walidos

    Walidos

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    I am sure it can. It is just something that is not easy to do, because you lose existing brand equity. What I am trying to tell you is the current brand equity expresses inherent bias and goes against your professed aims for this discussion space. Sure like i said not an easy decision at all.
    I think the rebranding/changing the logo and the colours already helps in setting it apart... the forum does indeed have a history linking it to FOM but has since evolved... we can simply call it the O room, without any link to Orange, be it the fruit or colour... this will maintain the equity while slowly further establish the forum as independent from any political entity.

    On the trolling subject, this is very difficult. Mods are an absolute must. But the rules need to be so clear as to make sure moderation is neither arbitrary nor biased.

    On the funding part, while I welcome removing the ads, it may become somewhat of a drainer for your finances! I have no idea how much maintianing this site costs yearly, but if we decide to go down that route, we should share the load... I’ll have a look at that link you added for funding and come back to you...
     
    Dark Angel

    Dark Angel

    Legendary Member
    allowing moderators to define trolling is a slippery slope. The very definition of trolling is subjective. If you want a forum that protects freedom of expression, the only thing you delete is profanity and personal insults. I have had recent posts deleted under the pretext of "deep trolling" or something like that, which is entirely unacceptable and who the hell defines what "deep trolling" is?
    the price of freedom is eternal vigilance. you have to make some sacrifices to preserve the higher good.
     
    J

    joseph_lubnan

    Legendary Member
    I think the rebranding/changing the logo and the colours already helps in setting it apart... the forum does indeed have a history linking it to FOM but has since evolved... we can simply call it the O room, without any link to Orange, be it the fruit or colour... this will maintain the equity while slowly further establish the forum as independent from any political entity.

    On the trolling subject, this is very difficult. Mods are an absolute must. But the rules need to be so clear as to make sure moderation is neither arbitrary nor biased.

    On the funding part, while I welcome removing the ads, it may become somewhat of a drainer for your finances! I have no idea how much maintianing this site costs yearly, but if we decide to go down that route, we should share the load... I’ll have a look at that link you added for funding and come back to you...
    I agree that an ad supported model (at least in part) is necessary and the ads never bothered me personally.
    On the moderating front this is a very important aspect in terms of assuring that the "integrity" of the forum is protected as this is one of the important element that Jo seems to be aiming at. No one should arbitrarily have to decide on what trolling is, and no one should be defining "deep trolling" there is a tendency for people to suppress opinions that irk them, and they view those as trolling. That is super subjective and certainly doesn't promote "integrity". What needs to be protected first and foremost is the freedom of expression if if at the expense of other aspects. I think only posts with profanity and personal insults should be deleted (of course there are advertising bots and other stuff, thats obvious though)

    O room is ok, but it is still a new brand and the same effort. In my opinion, if Jo wants to have a new brand, it should be created based on a mission statement for how he sees the forum.
     
    Walidos

    Walidos

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    @Jo insee what you mean, back to the old membership scheme... not Sure this will help make it a long lasting forum... but there will be a bunch of us willing to help every year, and we can do fundraising events.

    We also should host politicians from all sides for Q&A... the ones we had were awesome, some better than others when the guest actually answered and didn’t try to weasel out of the questions :) but these can be like interviews on media outlets that we publish...
     
    Lebanese Pride

    Lebanese Pride

    Well-Known Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    I really hate the fact that im neither mod nor admin even though im a legendary member here and that I won last year Mod election by tazkie
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

    Paragon of Bacon
    Orange Room Supporter
    allowing moderators to define trolling is a slippery slope. The very definition of trolling is subjective. If you want a forum that protects freedom of expression, the only thing you delete is profanity and personal insults. I have had recent posts deleted under the pretext of "deep trolling" or something like that, which is entirely unacceptable and who the hell defines what "deep trolling" is?
    One liners that are only there to derail a thread are trolling, get over it m8
     
    Mozz

    Mozz

    Active Member
    I think its the members that not up to the "forum" challenge.

    No one can put 2 sentences next to each other without abusing someone else or cursing. Everyone feels offended by everyone.
     
    Le منشار

    Le منشار

    New Member
    the first ailment this forum is suffering from is trolling. there is a new breed of users that takes nothing seriously and respects nothing, a couple of jokes is one thing, an established pattern of intentional trolling is something else all together, and will simply sabotage every discussion. there should be safeguards against that. additionally, the LVV/sadek2010 style of meaningless and nonstop feuds are pretty disturbing, there should also be safeguards against that.
    Donald the crusader, Putin the crusader :lol: ... man bass shu baddak if you read that thread, you can get a good laugh.
    especially when @LVV bi koun tale3 tale3to wou faj2a byezharlo @sadek2010 byofda7o ha ha ha ha ha
     
    Le منشار

    Le منشار

    New Member
    I think its the members that not up to the "forum" challenge.

    No one can put 2 sentences next to each other without abusing someone else or cursing. Everyone feels offended by everyone.
    3ala 2assess your avatar doesn't instigate offensive behavior ;)
     
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