Do Lebanese Christians and Muslims look different?

Ice Tea

Ice Tea

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Do you have a proof of that?




What? Askhenazi and Sephardi Jews plotting close to Lebanese Christians and Druzes, and Palestinians plotting with Bedouins and Saudi Arabians? I guess that pretty much settles who's native and who's the foreign invaders.
 
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  • Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    The thing about Lebanese Muslims is that they don't have more Southwest Asian (Arabian) admixture than Christians. I used to think they were heavily Arabian, but it seems they aren't.
    It's their Ottoman-era admixtures that set them apart from Christians.




    There's been hundreds of Lebanese Christians who tested and not a single one shows any sign of Arabian admixture whatsoever, these oral tales about Ghassanids, Christian Arabs etc are not supported scientifically. Lebanese Christians are basically pristine Levantines and are genetically closest to other Levantine Christians, Samaritans and Druze, who all form a single genetic cluster. Lebanese Muslims are an outer group and shift towards Syrian Muslims.

    But generally even the Lebanese Muslims do not show higher Arabian admixture than Christians, it's their East Asian and African ancestries along with some Caucasus and European that set them apart from Christians. All the non-native admixture in Lebanese Muslims is fairly recent (from the Ottoman Empire) which means they descend from people who were Christians at least until the Crusades. The Crusaders were really successful in expelling and killing all the Arabs Muslims, Lebanese Muslims descend from Christians who were forced to convert by the Seljuks and by the time of the Ottoman Empire they were just Muslims and mixing with other Muslims and raping African slaves, that's how they became different from Christians even if they were originally Christians themselves.
    Hundreds of lebanese is not a rule, there is a genetic base on which dozens of foreign civilizations were added. Get over it.

    U claimed that u can tell the difference between the looks of a muslim and christian lebanese, while in fact u can on tell the difference between them through social norms i.e headwear,beard styles etc
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    Frankly, I couldn't care less what people look like. I'm more concerned about what values they have.
    Great, then plz let me call this spade of a thread a spade.
     
    Resign

    Resign

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    Go ask someone from the hashem family about their origins, or even better go to akoura and ask to read its history and genealogy book


    Beautiful pic beghliya w beshrab mayyeta?

    There are lots of shiites Al Hashem in Jurd Jbeil

    Maronites Al Hashem could’ve been converts from the 1800s
    I don’t think that’s a good example

    Also 100 beats 1 ?
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    There are lots of shiites Al Hashem in Jurd Jbeil

    Maronites Al Hashem could’ve been converts from the 1800s
    I don’t think that’s a good example

    Also 100 beats 1 ?
    Every christian is a convert from something else if you want to go down that path. That doesnt make what i said any less true.

    Second, this is not the only case, the whole north of lebanon christian families have foreign roots, myself having yemeni roots. 1 in 100 u say?
     
    The_FPMer

    The_FPMer

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    Every christian is a convert from something else if you want to go down that path. That doesnt make what i said any less true.

    Second, this is not the only case, the whole north of lebanon christian families have foreign roots, myself having yemeni roots. 1 in 100 u say?
    How do you know you have Yemeni roots? DNA technology has advanced so much, J1 is no longer considered an "Arab" gene.
     
    Resign

    Resign

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    Every christian is a convert from something else if you want to go down that path. That doesnt make what i said any less true.
    Yes, but i don’t think that by Lebanese Christians the study refers to converts from last night.
    It refers to the original ethnic groups who preceeded the Arab invasions.

    You can’t include late converts in the same ethnicity group.

    Second, this is not the only case, the whole north of lebanon christian families have foreign roots, myself having yemeni roots. 1 in 100 u say?
    This is not true
    Maybe true in Akkar where Yemeni shiites resided/presided
    Other northerners could be traced to Assyrians (From Syria) who were also Canaanites.

    As for Al hashem and Aakoura families like Younes etc..
    Their last names sound very Arabian, Jordanian, North African, Moroccan to be of Maronite origins
    The names don’t even follow the pattern used by Mount Lebanon Maronites referring to a profession or town/natal village like Haddad, Najjar, Feghaly etc etc
     
    The_FPMer

    The_FPMer

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    Yes, but i don’t think that by Lebanese Christians the study refers to converts from last night.
    It refers to the original ethnic groups who preceeded the Arab invasions.

    You can’t include late converts in the same ethnicity group.



    This is not true
    Maybe true in Akkar where Yemeni shiites resided/presided
    Other northerners could be traced to Assyrians (From Syria) who were also Canaanites.

    As for Al hashem and Aakoura families like Younes etc..
    Their last names sound very Arabian, Jordanian, North African, Moroccan to be of Maronite origins
    The names don’t even follow the pattern used by Mount Lebanon Maronites referring to a profession or town/natal village like Haddad, Najjar, Feghaly etc etc
    You're right, but remember many changed their names to avoid persecution. The arabization of Lebanon and its population has been going on for centuries for that reason you find a Muslim called Mohammad Mansour in Morrocco and a Lebanese called Charbel Mansour. They don't descend from the same lineage but Arab culture and language was imposed on the latter.
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    How do you know you have Yemeni roots? DNA technology has advanced so much, J1 is no longer considered an "Arab" gene.
    Who cares if it’s arab or turkish or greek roots.. the point is that there is a very big genetic concoction throughout the lebanese population, its not as homogeneous as OP wants to paint.

    U cant discern muslims and christian just by looking at their physical traits
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    Yes, but i don’t think that by Lebanese Christians the study refers to converts from last night.
    It refers to the original ethnic groups who preceeded the Arab invasions.

    You can’t include late converts in the same ethnicity group.



    This is not true
    Maybe true in Akkar where Yemeni shiites resided/presided
    Other northerners could be traced to Assyrians (From Syria) who were also Canaanites.

    As for Al hashem and Aakoura families like Younes etc..
    Their last names sound very Arabian, Jordanian, North African, Moroccan to be of Maronite origins
    The names don’t even follow the pattern used by Mount Lebanon Maronites referring to a profession or town/natal village like Haddad, Najjar, Feghaly etc etc
    How very selective of you, so we’re only discussing mount lebanon christians now vs beiruti sunnis and hermel shiites? How about bcharre maronites vs koura orthodoxvs alay druze, do you get my drift?

    The point is the gene pool is very diverse, sometimes the lineage stayed true to canaanite origins other times foreign genes were introduced, depends in the region and its history. But still, you cant discern a muslim from a christian just by looking at physical traits as OP is trying to insinuate
     
    Resign

    Resign

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    How very selective of you, so we’re only discussing mount lebanon christians now vs beiruti sunnis and hermel shiites? How about bcharre maronites vs koura orthodoxvs alay druze, do you get my drift?
    Nope..
    As i said
    Northerners from Bcharri, Zgharta, Koura, parts of Batroun(Batroun the city was Phoenician) share the same Canaanite ancestry as Mount Lebanon christians and Druzes even though they could be traced back to Assyrians from Syria.

    Some villages still maintain a Syriac dialect even till this day
     
    Resign

    Resign

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    You're right, but remember many changed their names to avoid persecution. The arabization of Lebanon and its population has been going on for centuries for that reason you find a Muslim called Mohammad Mansour in Morrocco and a Lebanese called Charbel Mansour. They don't descend from the same lineage but Arab culture and language was imposed on the latter.
    I agree
    But i also don’t think it was the case for Aakoura Hashems because i doubt they were persecuted at any point.
    I believe they were originally shiite converts.
    (I could be be wrong)
     
    Iron Maiden

    Iron Maiden

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    Nope..
    As i said
    Northerners from Bcharri, Zgharta, Koura, parts of Batroun(Batroun the city was Phoenician) share the same Canaanite ancestry as Mount Lebanon christians and Druzes even though they could be traced back to Assyrians from Syria.

    Some villages still maintain a Syriac dialect even till this day
    3azim if i give u a pic if someone from batroun and someone from marje3youn, can you tell me which is which just by looking at the pic?

    Ba3do byehkine bl phonecians after 18 civilizations settled these lands
     
    Resign

    Resign

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    3azim if i give u a pic if someone from batroun and someone from marje3youn, can you tell me which is which just by looking at the pic?

    Ba3do byehkine bl phonecians after 18 civilizations settled these lands
    If both Batrouni va Marja3iouni are are pure (not hybrids) then yes
     
    Indie

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    Great, then plz let me call this spade of a thread a spade.
    Call it what you want :)

    Personally, I don't care what people look like, but I don't find this thread offensive either.
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

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    Hundreds of lebanese is not a rule, there is a genetic base on which dozens of foreign civilizations were added. Get over it.

    U claimed that u can tell the difference between the looks of a muslim and christian lebanese, while in fact u can on tell the difference between them through social norms i.e headwear,beard styles etc
    Heck, even the Druze, who are genetically identical to Christians, have a distinct look and pretty much everyone agrees on that. Why would Muslims, who are actually genetically different from Christians, look the same as Christians?

    I said I can easily distinguish Lebanese Christian and Muslim GROUPS, actually all Christians can. On an individual level there are some looks that are specific only to Muslims, so if you're of Muslim background you probably won't notice it but Christians do. I think all Lebanese Christians could pass for Muslims but not all Muslims could pass for Christians, and that because Muslims descend from Christians but also have considerable Ottoman-era admixtures.
     
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    fidelio

    fidelio

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    Why is it important to know if there are physiognomic differences between people of different sects?
     
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