Do Lebanese Christians and Muslims look different?

Iron Maiden

Iron Maiden

Paragon of Bacon
Orange Room Supporter
Heck, even the Druze, who are genetically identical to Christians, have a distinct look and pretty much everyone agrees on that. Why would Muslims, who are actually genetically different from Christians, look the same as Christians?

I said I can easily distinguish Lebanese Christian and Muslim GROUPS, actually all Christians can. On an individual level there are some looks that are specific only to Muslims, so if you're of Muslim background you probably won't notice it but Christians do. I think all Lebanese Christians could pass for Muslims but not all Muslims could pass for Christians, and that because Muslims descend from Christians but also have considerable Ottoman-era admixtures.
Ktir awe man i wish some day i can get an eyesight as powerful as yours and @Skunk ’s
 
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  • Mrsrxmas

    Mrsrxmas

    Somehow a Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    This thread proves itself by showing the results that inbreeding can have...
     
    Nonan

    Nonan

    Well-Known Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    This thread proves itself by showing the results that inbreeding can have...
    Why? I think it is a fair question. I personally think I look much more like a mixture of Sean Connery, Cary Grant and George Clooney than Rafic Hariri, Walid Joumblatt or Ali el Khalil... so the person who started this thread may be on to something...
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    This thread proves itself by showing the results that inbreeding can have...

    Agreed. Lebanese Muslims are severely inbred and that's probably one of the reasons (along with genetic differences) they look different from Christians
     
    Ynnad

    Ynnad

    New Member
    As we know, Lebanese Christians and Muslims are genetically two distinct populations. While Christians remained genetically almost identical to ancient Canaanites, Muslims acquired a lot of foreign admixture during the Ottoman empire according to latest studies. While this suggests that Muslims descend from people who were Christians at the fall of the Crusader States, once they became Muslims they started mixing with other Muslim groups in the Empire, which set them apart from Christians genetically speaking.

    Given the wide range of admixtures (Turkic/Asian, Caucasus, African and some European) that Muslims have and Christians lack, it's only natural to expect a phenotypical variation between these two different populations. For example, I don't think it's that easy to distinguish a Christian and a Muslim on an individual level, but they definitely look different as groups. For instance, I've noticed Christians are much more homogenous and have mostly a standard Mediterranean look, while Muslims are much more varied and have a higher frequency of extreme looks (both very dark and very light) that are very unusual for Christians. Imo Sunnis from Tripoli and Sidon, and Shias from the South and Bekaa look the most different from Christians.
    Hello, as a Lebanese Muslim I read the entirety of your com, and I notice that there are statements that you said that I do not agree, for example the fact to say that there There is no significant Arabic gene on Muslims, but genetic studies prove the opposite as you can see from the study below in the "Genome-wide structure of the Levantines" tab that reads: "In order to assess the population structure of Levantine populations, MDS (Figure 2) and a normalized population component analysis (PCA) (Figure S2) plots with 48 additional Old World populations (Table S1) were built. The plots reveal a Levantine structure, and Lebanese Muslims are extended to Syrians, Palestinians, and Jordanians, from which they are used to reduce their size (Figure S3). are close t o Saudis and Bedouins. Ashkenazi Jews are drawn towards the Caucasus and Eastern Europe, reflecting historical admixture events with Europeans, while Sephardi Jews cluster tightly with the Levantine groups. These results are consistent with previous studies of higher European genome-wide admixture in Ashkenazi Jews compared with other Jews [11] and higher Y-chromosomal gene flow to Lebanese Muslims from the Arabian Peninsula compared with other Lebanese [5]. "
    There is also another study that proves that some Lebanese are genetically Arab: "Fascinatingly, most Lebanese individuals were predicted along the northwestern incense route leading from southern Arabia to the Mediterranean, used by merchants between the 4th century BC and the 2nd century AD This multi-origin of the Lebanese (Fig. 3 [C1]) can be explained by the 7th century Arabian expansion, which saw a large scale movement of Arabian tribes from the Arabian Peninsula in the Middle East, or by the northern expansion of nomadic Bedouin tribes known as the Nabataeans by the end of the fourth century The Northern Lebanon and the Southern Levant for four hundred years, making migration to Lebanon at this time highly probable.35 However, both Nabatean and late Arab conquerors inhabited the same geographical regions and similar historical periods, they are likely to share the same genetic background. Therefore, the exact ancestry of ancestral populations, currently unavailable. " Reconstructing Druze population history
    Many Lebanese are true Arabs, obviously not the majority, but that does not mean that there are no real Arabs in Lebanon
    If you are Lebanese you must know that a certain number of Lebanese from Baalbeck and Hermel are Arab and belong to Arab tribes like Miqdad, Jaafar Solh etc who come from Iraq.
    There are also Sunni Bedouin villages in the Akkar (Wadi Khaled Hnaider machta Hassan Machta Hammoud etc.), in the south of Beirut towards what is called as sehel (khaldeh and ne3meh), as well as in the Bekaa and many are nomadic, I want to clarify that the Bedouins of Lebanon are present since the 13th century
    1 / file: /// C: /Users/WINDOWS/Desktop/StatelessnessinLebanon2013.pdf
    2 /
    I could also send videos about Bedouin from Lebanon or the fact that the Bedouin presence dates back to antiquity http://publication.doa.gov.jo/Publications/ViewChapterPublic/1186
     
    Ynnad

    Ynnad

    New Member
    As we know, Lebanese Christians and Muslims are genetically two distinct populations. While Christians remained genetically almost identical to ancient Canaanites, Muslims acquired a lot of foreign admixture during the Ottoman empire according to latest studies. While this suggests that Muslims descend from people who were Christians at the fall of the Crusader States, once they became Muslims they started mixing with other Muslim groups in the Empire, which set them apart from Christians genetically speaking.

    Given the wide range of admixtures (Turkic/Asian, Caucasus, African and some European) that Muslims have and Christians lack, it's only natural to expect a phenotypical variation between these two different populations. For example, I don't think it's that easy to distinguish a Christian and a Muslim on an individual level, but they definitely look different as groups. For instance, I've noticed Christians are much more homogenous and have mostly a standard Mediterranean look, while Muslims are much more varied and have a higher frequency of extreme looks (both very dark and very light) that are very unusual for Christians. Imo Sunnis from Tripoli and Sidon, and Shias from the South and Bekaa look the most different from Christians.
    Hello, as a Lebanese Muslim I read the entirety of your com, and I notice that there are statements that you said that I do not agree, for example the fact to say that there There is no significant Arabic gene on Muslims, but genetic studies prove the opposite as you can see from the study below in the "Genome-wide structure of the Levantines" tab that reads: "In order to assess the population structure of Levantine populations, MDS (Figure 2) and a normalized population component analysis (PCA) (Figure S2) plots with 48 additional Old World populations (Table S1) were built. The plots reveal a Levantine structure, and Lebanese Muslims are extended to Syrians, Palestinians, and Jordanians, from which they are used to reduce their size (Figure S3). are close t o Saudis and Bedouins. Ashkenazi Jews are drawn towards the Caucasus and Eastern Europe, reflecting historical admixture events with Europeans, while Sephardi Jews cluster tightly with the Levantine groups. These results are consistent with previous studies of higher European genome-wide admixture in Ashkenazi Jews compared with other Jews [11] and higher Y-chromosomal gene flow to Lebanese Muslims from the Arabian Peninsula compared with other Lebanese [5]. "
    There is also another study that proves that some Lebanese are genetically Arab: "Fascinatingly, most Lebanese individuals were predicted along the northwestern incense route leading from southern Arabia to the Mediterranean, used by merchants between the 4th century BC and the 2nd century AD This multi-origin of the Lebanese (Fig. 3 [C1]) can be explained by the 7th century Arabian expansion, which saw a large scale movement of Arabian tribes from the Arabian Peninsula in the Middle East, or by the northern expansion of nomadic Bedouin tribes known as the Nabataeans by the end of the fourth century The Northern Lebanon and the Southern Levant for four hundred years, making migration to Lebanon at this time highly probable.35 However, both Nabatean and late Arab conquerors inhabited the same geographical regions and similar historical periods, they are likely to share the same genetic background. Therefore, the exact ancestry of ancestral populations, currently unavailable. " Reconstructing Druze population history
    Many Lebanese are true Arabs, obviously not the majority, but that does not mean that there are no real Arabs in Lebanon
    If you are Lebanese you must know that a certain number of Lebanese from Baalbeck and Hermel are Arab and belong to Arab tribes like Miqdad, Jaafar Solh etc who come from Iraq.
    There are also Sunni Bedouin villages in the Akkar (Wadi Khaled Hnaider machta Hassan Machta Hammoud etc.), in the south of Beirut towards what is called as sehel (khaldeh and ne3meh), as well as in the Bekaa and many are nomadic, I want to clarify that the Bedouins of Lebanon are present since the 13th century
    1 / file: /// C: /Users/WINDOWS/Desktop/StatelessnessinLebanon2013.pdf
    2 /
    I could also send videos about Bedouin from Lebanon or the fact that the Bedouin presence dates back to antiquity http://publication.doa.gov.jo/Publications/ViewChapterPublic/1186
     
    Ynnad

    Ynnad

    New Member
    Hello, as a Lebanese Muslim I read the entirety of your com, and I notice that there are statements that you said that I do not agree, for example the fact to say that there There is no significant Arabic gene on Muslims, but genetic studies prove the opposite as you can see from the study below in the "Genome-wide structure of the Levantines" tab that reads: "In order to assess the population structure of Levantine populations, MDS (Figure 2) and a normalized population component analysis (PCA) (Figure S2) plots with 48 additional Old World populations (Table S1) were built. The plots reveal a Levantine structure, and Lebanese Muslims are extended to Syrians, Palestinians, and Jordanians, from which they are used to reduce their size (Figure S3). are close t o Saudis and Bedouins. Ashkenazi Jews are drawn towards the Caucasus and Eastern Europe, reflecting historical admixture events with Europeans, while Sephardi Jews cluster tightly with the Levantine groups. These results are consistent with previous studies of higher European genome-wide admixture in Ashkenazi Jews compared with other Jews [11] and higher Y-chromosomal gene flow to Lebanese Muslims from the Arabian Peninsula compared with other Lebanese [5]. "
    There is also another study that proves that some Lebanese are genetically Arab: "Fascinatingly, most Lebanese individuals were predicted along the northwestern incense route leading from southern Arabia to the Mediterranean, used by merchants between the 4th century BC and the 2nd century AD This multi-origin of the Lebanese (Fig. 3 [C1]) can be explained by the 7th century Arabian expansion, which saw a large scale movement of Arabian tribes from the Arabian Peninsula in the Middle East, or by the northern expansion of nomadic Bedouin tribes known as the Nabataeans by the end of the fourth century The Northern Lebanon and the Southern Levant for four hundred years, making migration to Lebanon at this time highly probable.35 However, both Nabatean and late Arab conquerors inhabited the same geographical regions and similar historical periods, they are likely to share the same genetic background. Therefore, the exact ancestry of ancestral populations, currently unavailable. " Reconstructing Druze population history
    Many Lebanese are true Arabs, obviously not the majority, but that does not mean that there are no real Arabs in Lebanon
    If you are Lebanese you must know that a certain number of Lebanese from Baalbeck and Hermel are Arab and belong to Arab tribes like Miqdad, Jaafar Solh etc who come from Iraq.
    There are also Sunni Bedouin villages in the Akkar (Wadi Khaled Hnaider machta Hassan Machta Hammoud etc.), in the south of Beirut towards what is called as sehel (khaldeh and ne3meh), as well as in the Bekaa and many are nomadic, I want to clarify that the Bedouins of Lebanon are present since the 13th century
    1 / file: /// C: /Users/WINDOWS/Desktop/StatelessnessinLebanon2013.pdf
    2 /
    I could also send videos about Bedouin from Lebanon or the fact that the Bedouin presence dates back to antiquity http://publication.doa.gov.jo/Publications/ViewChapterPublic/1186
    Sorry, I forgot to put it, the first study is Genome-Wide Diversity in the Levant Reveals Recent Structuring by Culture
     
    Last edited:
    XMyso

    XMyso

    Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Who’s we and which scientific paper proved this?
    Racial anthropology and genetics of the Lebanese by Daniel (Dan’El) Asade Chuckralla.


    MUSLIMS


    The cranium is mesocephalic and high. Their forehead is narrow like the internal margin of the eyes and inclined as the Armeniod type. The face’ s height is more than in the Bedouins. They’re leptoprosopics and almost mesorrhines. They’re more brachycephalics than the Bedouins and the distance between their eyes is bigger. The vertex position is more posterior and the face is bigger and longer, alike the nose. If they have dark brown eyes, they are more Araboid Mediterranean, while the clearer eyes are more brachycephalic, thus it means, a presence of Nordic and Armeniod.


    The Armeniod characteristic is evident in the nose, the shape of the head and in the initial part of the face and the Nordic’s dash along the face and the light eyes. In the Muslims the race Araboid-Mediterranean is predominant and in second place the Armenoid comes with a Nordic adulteration. Muslims are more dolycocephalics than the Orthodox Greeks, have a higher head, similar to the bizigamtic diameter, more leptoprosopics and less leptorhines, hence, the Orthodox Greeks are more Armeniods than the Araboids.. Maronites and Syrians, vary from Muslims in the great proportion of Armeniod elements that the first hold.


    MARONITES


    Their skin is moderated dark for the region. The cranium is hiperbrachycephalic absolutely very high and in relation to longitude and large. They’ re not broad in forehead and face, but these dimensions are greater than in Samaritans, Bedouins and Turkish. The forehead is narrow if we think of the wide face but the face is tight related to the bi-parietal length. They’re mesoprosopics with a big leptoprosopic inclination. Noses are not very long and with moderate size, mesorhine type. The ears are big. The dominant element is Armeniod, the evidence is the brachycephalic the face’s wide, mesoprosopism and the low frequency of nasal appendix. Second is the Iranoid. Third has somewhat of mixture with Mediterranean, Nordics or Eastern Baltic. It has a extreme relation with druzes, but those’ re more Armeniods hence their big bizigomatic diameter. The Nusayries have more Iranoid elements thus they have longer and narrow heads, tight and short face and mesorrhine nose. Orthodox Greeks are less brachycephalics, the head is lower, the forehead is narrow, the higher and with little wider, that’ s a consequence of the strong presence of Mediterranean element in Orthodox Greeks.



    DRUZES


    The cranium is high and hiperbrachycephalic. In the face they’ re mesoporsopics in the direction of europrosopics. Long noses and not very big, mesorrhines and nearly leptorrhines. With brown eyes ‘re very Armeniods.They have elements of Eastern Baltic and Nordics. Such as the Maronites the main element is Armeniod. The Nusairiyyeh ‘ re different because they’ re more brachycephalics. with narrower foreheads and faces, long face like the nose. Greeks Orthodox, Syrians and Armenians have not relation to the Druzes. The Greeks Orthodox are more Mediterranean than Druzes, while Syrians are more Armeniods
     
    NewB

    NewB

    Legendary Member
    Imagine if the muslims started marrying christians who would slowly convert them in turn blending the genetic pool....mindblowing!
     
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