WC2018 FINAL - France vs. Croatia [4-2]

Isabella

The queen of "Bazella"
Orange Room Supporter
That wasnt my point, i know very well that your children spend the largest part of their time outside lebanon and it would be dumb to expect they wouldnt feel attached tontheir homes culture, which is the problem of the many immigrants in europe who after 3-4 generations only swear by a country they’ve never been too. But i digress.

Now read the following from iso

This is what i said shame to, she isnt giving her the chance to get the lebanese identity in her child since day 1.

I hav 3 cousins who grew up outside lebanon, same family and values and eduction, two of them dont really give a shite abt lebanon while the third is politically active, went to study at aub and is preparing to start a family there.

Its a choice that the children will do, but they will only do it if u give them a chance of getting to know the country and its people’s culture.
I hope i misunderstood what you wrote iso but to me it sounded like that decision was already made.

You're overexaggerating what I said, I said I will teach my daughter about her heritage, her father and I will be speaking to her in Arabic, and we will even be teaching her how to write it... She will go on holidays to Lebanon, and get to meet our families/friends, she will even have a Lebanese passport... However where she grows up and where she will live the majority of her life is France, and this will be the country she will most likely identify with!

I'm not trying and definitely do not want to give my children the same experiences I've lived through in Lebanon, certainly not my daughter... She will get to know the good and the bad my and her father's society had to offer!

It's just a basic fact that my daughter would most likely identify as French rather than Lebanese! And I'm perfectly fine with that!
 

Mrsrx

Not an expert!
Staff member
Call me an idealist, but I don't think that is the case in France, at least when it comes to race (I'm not talking here about people from Maghreb). Not sure how well you know the US but everything there is "race" or "origin based": African American, Latino, Asian-American, American-born-Chinese, etc. It is crazy. That was not my experience in France. I found France to be more socio-economics based. You wear a suit, you have an engineering degree, your French is flawless, you know your wines, then race doesn't really matter.

Anyway, I would refer everyone to Benjamin Mendy's tweet (see Le Monde Article, above in this page).

As to @Isabella's children, she can speak her mind. My children were born in the US. Their mother is French. I teach them that they have 3 cultures: Lebanese, French and American. They don't need to exclude. But they are 100% Americans (well, New Yorkers), 100% French and 100% Lebanese...

They eat Za3tar, Kebbe and Hommos like there is no tomorrow. But also eat Crepes, Steak Frites... and they like cookies.

But let's be realistic. They spend 80% of their time in the US, 15% of their time in France and 5% of their time in Lebanon so...

I totally agree about the second generation they will feel at home unless they were shielded and ghettoed but their region or parents. A person can have only one identity but they can be a mix of french/lebanese/america/...

On the other hand first generation is a bit more complex (speaking from experience as i am now a bi-national)...it is not easy to kick the first 20 years of your life! and that will always feel like home to you even if you would never go back.

In the words of the great philosopher Eric Cantona:
"You can change your wife but will never be able to change your team" ...this can be easily adapted to the feeling first generation immigrants feel.
 

gramsci

Legendary Member
I know.

Here are a couple of "Italian" jokes :)


2) 1940's vintage: What's very specific to Italian tanks? They have one forward speed and 5 reverse speeds


Well talking about WwIi , expept some battalion in mussolini army the rest were really trash army..
But its not that french performance during the war was such brilliant lol
 
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joseph_lubnan

Legendary Member
You're overexaggerating what I said, I said I will teach my daughter about her heritage, her father and I will be speaking to her in Arabic, and we will even be teaching her how to write it... She will go on holidays to Lebanon, and get to meet our families/friends, she will even have a Lebanese passport... However where she grows up and where she will live the majority of her life is France, and this will be the country she will most likely identify with!

I'm not trying and definitely do not want to give my children the same experiences I've lived through in Lebanon, certainly not my daughter... She will get to know the good and the bad my and her father's society had to offer!

It's just a basic fact that my daughter would most likely identify as French rather than Lebanese! And I'm perfectly fine with that!

She is French already not going to be French. It's normal. :)
 

gramsci

Legendary Member
I know.

Here are a couple of "Italian" jokes :)

1) 2000 Vintage: How do you "re-cork" a bottle of Champagne? Ask the Italians (reference to the Euro 2000 final). To be fair, the Italians ended up getting their revenge in 2006
2) 1940's vintage: What's very specific to Italian tanks? They have one forward speed and 5 reverse speeds


Ive been to france several times : strasbourg, dijon , colmar , paris .and im used on all kind of stereotypes lol..
The last one i heard is that Venice is ugly and full with rats :p and the girl saying it was insisting lol .. So no comment .. I love venice and i must visit it once in a year , i was like : shut up u baguette face, paris is full with rats .
 

Skairipa

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
it suffices to witness how the slime ganged up on me like hyenas with all sorts of labels and accusations ranging from racism to bigotry, without neglecting to bring in Christianity into the mix, while the post of @Abou Sandal - about the law passed in israel declaring that only Jews have the right of self determination - did not invoke or merit any reactions, to realize how deep the festering has reached into these members minds and characters and how intellectually castrated they collectively are.

in all honesty every time i have to deal with these people it feels as if i have taken a dive into the sewage and i am in dire need for a bath to clean their stench off. there used to be a time where members were able to ping ideas and objectively discuss topics and notions even; but seemingly they are long gone, and now we are in a community that cherishes hasbara trolls, perverts and people who are unable to produce anything other than one liners even if their lives depended on it.

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast. ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them. under their feet, and turn again and rend you.​
and that says it all.

Don't enable the racists @SeaAb.
 

gramsci

Legendary Member
Here another funny one :D:

Heaven is a British policeman, a French chef, a German mechanic, an Italian lover, and it’s all managed by the Swiss.
Hell is a German policeman, a British chef, a French mechanic, a Swiss lover, and it’s all managed by the Italians.
 

Nonan

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
That wasnt my point, i know very well that your children spend the largest part of their time outside lebanon and it would be dumb to expect they wouldnt feel attached tontheir homes culture, which is the problem of the many immigrants in europe who after 3-4 generations only swear by a country they’ve never been too. But i digress.

Now read the following from iso

This is what i said shame to, she isnt giving her the chance to get the lebanese identity in her child since day 1.

I hav 3 cousins who grew up outside lebanon, same family and values and eduction, two of them dont really give a shite abt lebanon while the third is politically active, went to study at aub and is preparing to start a family there.

Its a choice that the children will do, but they will only do it if u give them a chance of getting to know the country and its people’s culture.
I hope i misunderstood what you wrote iso but to me it sounded like that decision was already made.

I agree with you. I think Iso clarified her point. Regardless though, while I agree with you and my wife and I have made a different choice for my daughters, every parent faces a different context.

I know some parents may be worried that racists bigots are going to question their children's "Frenchness " (or "Americanism", etc.) - as we've seen some people do on the forum here - because they demonstrate that they are also from other origins, the parents may ask them to hide that side of their origins to protect them.
 

Abou Sandal

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
it suffices to witness how the slime ganged up on me like hyenas with all sorts of labels and accusations ranging from racism to bigotry, without neglecting to bring in Christianity into the mix, while the post of @Abou Sandal - about the law passed in israel declaring that only Jews have the right of self determination - did not invoke or merit any reactions, to realize how deep the festering has reached into these members minds and characters and how intellectually castrated they collectively are.

in all honesty every time i have to deal with these people it feels as if i have taken a dive into the sewage and i am in dire need for a bath to clean their stench off. there used to be a time where members were able to ping ideas and objectively discuss topics and notions even; but seemingly they are long gone, and now we are in a community that cherishes hasbara trolls, perverts and people who are unable to produce anything other than one liners even if their lives depended on it.

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast. ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them. under their feet, and turn again and rend you.​
and that says it all.


When someone like @Muki rushes at each corner to denounce you as a racist, then you can be sure that you are on the path of righteousness.

(PS: Big emphasis on the verb "denounce". See...In all times, and throughout ages, there has always been those who dare and defy...and those who denounce.)
 
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Skairipa

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
it suffices to witness how the slime ganged up on me like hyenas with all sorts of labels and accusations ranging from racism to bigotry, without neglecting to bring in Christianity into the mix, while the post of @Abou Sandal - about the law passed in israel declaring that only Jews have the right of self determination - did not invoke or merit any reactions, to realize how deep the festering has reached into these members minds and characters and how intellectually castrated they collectively are.

in all honesty every time i have to deal with these people it feels as if i have taken a dive into the sewage and i am in dire need for a bath to clean their stench off. there used to be a time where members were able to ping ideas and objectively discuss topics and notions even; but seemingly they are long gone, and now we are in a community that cherishes hasbara trolls, perverts and people who are unable to produce anything other than one liners even if their lives depended on it.

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast. ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them. under their feet, and turn again and rend you.​
and that says it all.
When someone like @Muki rushes at each corner to denounce you as a racist, then you can be sure that you are on the path of righteousness.

(PS: Big emphasis on the verb "denounce". See...In all times, and throughout ages, there has always been those who dare and defy...and those who denounce.)

An antisemite and a racist walk into a bar...
 
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