First FPM-FM meeting since 2005

[Hawkeye]

Longtime rivals the Future Movement and the Free Patriotic Movement will meet Thursday and attempt to find common ground, a development that could ease the nation’s stifling political impasse. (Daily Star)

لقاءٌ اول سيجمع التيار الوطني الحر وتيار المستقبل الخميس لمحاولة التوصُل الى قواسمَ مشتركة وطنية

بادر البرتقالي وتجاوب الأزرق، فموعد ولقاء الخميس هو الأول من نوعه بين الطرفين منذ اعوام. بعد تواصله مع رئيس المجلس النيابي نبيه بري وانفتاحه على الإشتراكي يستكمل التيار الوطني الحر تنفيذ توصيات خلوة دير القلعة محاولاً خرق الجمود الحاصل وملء الفراغ المؤسساتي بحركة قد تسهم بعودة الحياةالى المجلس النيابي في لحظة الترقب الإقليمي لمجريات الأزمة السورية يقبع عدد من القضايا الداخلية وعلى رأسها الملف الحكومي في ثلاجة الإنتظار، واقع يرفضه تكتل التغيير والإصلاح رغم التباعد الواضح والتباين في وجهات النظر ً يجمع الطرفان على نيتهما الجدية تحضير الأرضية للتوصل الى قواسم وطنية مشتركة وتبقى الأيام المقبلة خير اختبار لصدق النوايا وترجمتها الى افعال
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http://www.otv.com.lb/beta/v/episode/tayyar_musta2bal-meeting-5591

Do you think this is a positive step? could it lead to a new FM-FPM relationship? will a dialogue between the two rivals be fruitful amid Syria's raging civil war?

 

[Libnene Qu7]

Dialogue and openness is always a positive step. HA has had excellent results when they started a few years ago with PSP. Now Joumblatt swears by the Sayed's robes.

 

[fkf]

Dialogue and openness is always a positive step. HA has had excellent results when they started a few years ago with PSP. Now Joumblatt swears by the Sayed's robes.

I hate to say this and be the pessimist here, but there is nothing in common between the two parties. When I say nothing, I mean absolutely nothing.
This so called meeting will result in exactly that, nothing. If they agree on things, the FM will screw the FPM a few days later, and blame the FPM with a vicious campaign of hate and political whoring. . This is what they do, and always done.
They are a bunch of hypocrites, sectarian parasites, backstabbers, and have no say in anything in Lebanon. They wait for their orders from KSA, or the US and they apply them to the letter.
The FPM is better off meeting with Saudi and US official, they’ll get better results that way.

 

[ecce homo]

Et votre réunion demain (aujourd’hui) avec le courant du Futur ?
Nous avons décidé d’établir un dialogue avec toutes les parties pour tenter de trouver une issue à la paralysie actuelle des institutions, surtout au niveau du législatif. Les dossiers politiques peuvent donc rester en suspens, mais cela ne devrait pas nous empêcher de légiférer sur des questions non conflictuelles. Nous avons entamé notre série de rencontres avec le président de la Chambre et nous voulons continuer avec toutes les autres parties. D’abord pour tenter de faciliter la formation du gouvernement, et ensuite pour légiférer. Notre objectif premier est de sortir de la paralysie institutionnelle. Nous pensons aussi que le dialogue peut briser le mur de l’hostilité et aboutir à l’équation suivante : avoir des divergences ne signifie pas être ennemis. Nous commençons donc avec de bonnes intentions. Nous espérons aboutir à des résultats concrets car ce serait dans l’intérêt du Liban.

Certains estiment que vous avez l’art de tendre la main au mauvais moment. Vous avez ainsi conclu un accord avec le Hezbollah quand ce dernier s’est engagé dans un processus régional et ne peut plus vous aider sur le plan interne. Vous avez établi un dialogue avec le régime syrien à la veille de son déclin et, enfin, vous avez entrepris une ouverture en direction de l’Arabie au moment où elle est opposée à presque tout le monde et avec les parties internes quand tout est bloqué... Commençons par le Hezbollah.
Notre relation avec la résistance a véritablement commencé en 2006 et s’est consolidée pendant la guerre de juillet contre Israël. À ce moment-là, tout le monde croyait que la résistance serait écrasée, mais j’avais dit le contraire. Les déclarations de sayyed Nasrallah par la suite ont montré la valeur qu’il attache à cette position et les chiites en général nous prouvent chaque jour l’importance de notre relation avec le Hezbollah.

Mais vous, quel bénéfice avez-vous tiré de cette entente, surtout maintenant ?
Je ne cherche pas les bénéfices pour moi, mais pour la patrie. Je pense que la stabilité actuelle dans le Mont-Liban, au Sud et dans la Békaa est en grande partie due à cette entente et bénéficie à tous les Libanais, qu’ils nous appuient ou non.

....

Quid de votre ouverture sur l’Arabie saoudite ?
Tous les ambassadeurs accrédités au Liban viennent me voir. Les divergences politiques n’excluent pas la courtoisie diplomatique. Si nous voulons la stabilité et si l’Arabie veut contribuer à cette stabilité, c’est une valeur ajoutée à nos relations.

http://www.tayyar.org/Tayyar/News/PoliticalNews/fr-FR/michel-aoun-pb-950748747.htm

 

[Hyperbole]

I hate to say this and be the pessimist here, but there is nothing in common between the two parties. When I say nothing, I mean absolutely nothing.
This so called meeting will result in exactly that, nothing. If they agree on things, the FM will screw the FPM a few days later, and blame the FPM with a vicious campaign of hate and political whoring. . This is what they do, and always done.
They are a bunch of hypocrites, sectarian parasites, backstabbers, and have no say in anything in Lebanon. They wait for their orders from KSA, or the US and they apply them to the letter.
The FPM is better off meeting with Saudi and US official, they’ll get better results that way.

This seems like just a gesture of goodwill. There can be no common ground between FPM and FM on anything, simply because it is the FM's orders to contradict every move FPM makes. FM is not allowed to ease up on government, oil, telecom, electricity, presidency, or any other issue without a direct 'OK' from KSA. That said, I'm happy that FPM is trying to be open-minded towards everyone, including FM and PSP in order to break the ice; even if it is just a fruitless gesture in this case. Let's not forget the 'up yours' to LF that this openness brings. That's always fun.

 

[JeanH]

لن تستقيم الأمور بين التيار والمستقبل حتى تتوقف العقلية الذمية التي ينتهجها مع المسيحيين منذ عام ١٩٩٢ حتى اليوم​

 

[Venom]

17:44 إنتهاء لقاء نواب التيار الوطني الحر مع المستقبل: مجدلاني: - اللقاء كان إيجابيا ومثمرا ويُبنى عليه - أكدنا على ضرورة تشكيل حكومة سريعة - أكدنا على ضرورة انسحاب حزب الله من سورية - أكدنا على ضرورة احترام المواقيت الدستورية لجهة انتخاب رئيس للجمهورية - كان لقاؤنا متسما بالصراحة ونرى الحوار الحلّ الوحيد للتواصل
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Tayyar

 

[Jo]

LBCI BREAKING NEWS: #Future Movement and #FPM agree on the need for #Hezbollah to withdraw its fighters from #Syria

 

[Ashrafieh_LF]

I hate to say this and be the pessimist here, but there is nothing in common between the two parties. When I say nothing, I mean absolutely nothing.
This so called meeting will result in exactly that, nothing. If they agree on things, the FM will screw the FPM a few days later, and blame the FPM with a vicious campaign of hate and political whoring. . This is what they do, and always done.
They are a bunch of hypocrites, sectarian parasites, backstabbers, and have no say in anything in Lebanon. They wait for their orders from KSA, or the US and they apply them to the letter.
The FPM is better off meeting with Saudi and US official, they’ll get better results that way.

FPM has a lot more in common with FM than with HA. Why talk to HA when you can talk to Iran?

 

[Salmoun]

there is nothing in common between the two parties. When I say nothing, I mean absolutely nothing.

In the “Kernel” both parties are not so different.

One major common point: both are sectarian parties that intend being secular.
And the sectarian part is common to all current Lebanese parties in Power.

Other common point: both of them have currently members in parliament (the first voted the extension and the second refused it with a lot of blab bla bla without even one minor action)

As I said, the “kernel” is the same. You may be speaking of FPM pre-2005 version, but the one of 2014 is completely different.

BR

 

[Hameed]

another silly play, we bury the children of the people while they're still young then we raise a toast with glass filled with blood

then we wait for the next tragedy to occur and we repeat the same process again and again .... do you think any of us is going to heaven ??!? heaven does exist but it won't be for us ... we're in hell

disgusting

 

[Salmoun]

another silly play, we bury the children of the people while they're still young then we raise a toast with glass filled with blood

then we wait for the next tragedy to occur and we repeat the same process again and again .... do you think any of us is going to heaven ??!? heaven do exist but it won't be for us ... we're in hell

disgusting

I am pretty sure that you smoke something before coming to post in here. :Arze1: !
Do you understand what you write? It is not the first time that your posts amaze me.

 

[Hameed]

I am pretty sure that you smoke something before coming to post in here. :Arze1: !
Do you understand what you write? It is not the first time that your posts amaze me.

that's because you still live in the boundaries of the matrix, let me make it easier ... you still live within the borders of the playground drawn for you

I guess it is fair enough to reply to you in an ambiguous way since your response was similar.

 

[Salmoun]

that's because you still live in the boundaries of the matrix, let me make it easier ... you still live within the borders of the playground drawn for you

I guess it is fair enough to reply to you in an ambiguous way since your response was similar.

I am unable to understand what you write. I often feel that your posts are out of subject or without any clear meaning.

It may be also me who is smoking a lot in the last days.

All the best in your matrix.

 

[Ashrafieh_LF]

I am unable to understand what you write. I often feel that your posts are out of subject or without any clear meaning.

It may be also me who is smoking a lot in the last days.

All the best in your matrix.

He's definitely in a lower triangular matrix!

 

[Hameed]

I am unable to understand what you write. I often feel that your posts are out of subject or without any clear meaning.

It may be also me who is smoking a lot in the last days.

maybe since I know I am a non-smoker of any type of weed

All the best in your matrix.

I am already out of it

 

[JeanH]

I hate to say this and be the pessimist here, but there is nothing in common between the two parties. When I say nothing, I mean absolutely nothing.
This so called meeting will result in exactly that, nothing. If they agree on things, the FM will screw the FPM a few days later, and blame the FPM with a vicious campaign of hate and political whoring. . This is what they do, and always done.
They are a bunch of hypocrites, sectarian parasites, backstabbers, and have no say in anything in Lebanon. They wait for their orders from KSA, or the US and they apply them to the letter.
The FPM is better off meeting with Saudi and US official, they’ll get better results that way.

couldn't agree more ...

 

[L'arbalette]

In the “Kernel” both parties are not so different.

One major common point: both are sectarian parties that intend being secular.
And the sectarian part is common to all current Lebanese parties in Power.

Other common point: both of them have currently members in parliament (the first voted the extension and the second refused it with a lot of blab bla bla without even one minor action)

As I said, the “kernel” is the same. You may be speaking of FPM pre-2005 version, but the one of 2014 is completely different.

BR

Is BR meant to say Broken Record? Cause you do sound like one.

The two parties have nothing in common, despite your weird logic (one voted for the extension, the other opposed it... but they have that in common?)

However, there is a fundamental question... FM represent likely 15 to 20% of Lebanon and at least 50% of the sunnites (in terms of vote). you either say "I don't care" (and the FM did that), or you say we have to try to understand if they can alter their agenda and together we could build an MoU (a la HA-FPM MoU)... The reality is however, we have fundamentally different views of the future of Lebanon and the whole purpose of FM is to maintain Hariri's grip on the country...

 

[Salmoun]

Is BR meant to say Broken Record? Cause you do sound like one.

As you wish. If you feel good with this translation, I am ok.

The two parties have nothing in common, despite your weird logic (one voted for the extension, the other opposed it... but they have that in common?)

Again, One major common point: both are sectarian parties that intend being secular

All other differences become details.

However, there is a fundamental question... FM represent likely 15 to 20% of Lebanon and at least 50% of the sunnites (in terms of vote). you either say "I don't care" (and the FM did that), or you say we have to try to understand if they can alter their agenda and together we could build an MoU (a la HA-FPM MoU)... The reality is however, we have fundamentally different views of the future of Lebanon and the whole purpose of FM is to maintain Hariri's grip on the country...

Your calculation are pure electoral.

For the “views” part, there is no big difference. Hariri wants to keep his grip on the country and GMA want also to have his share of the GRIP …. FM never wanted to reform the country even if Hariri father came with such program, neither FPM will do anything even if they still raising the flag of reforms now.

If you still consider FPM as reformist party, you are mistaken my friend, long time ago, they stopped this silly activity called reforms. Letting down C.Nahas was the biggest sign of policy change. Not to mention the great reforms being done by the culture minister to protect real states companies interests.

And some FPMers like to praise Bassil and Sahnaoui work and call it reform. Both ministers are doing their job but since the one before were not doing anything, a single minor thing become big.

The word “Reform” has a big meaning and FPM work and policies are not aligned with the meaning of this word. Hariri also was considered reformist when he first came but we discovered later on that he wasn’t, worse, he was destructive.

Broken Record

 

[L'arbalette]

As you wish. If you feel good with this translation, I am ok.



Again, One major common point: both are sectarian parties that intend being secular

All other differences become details.



Your calculation are pure electoral.

For the “views” part, there is no big difference. Hariri wants to keep his grip on the country and GMA want also to have his share of the GRIP …. FM never wanted to reform the country even if Hariri father came with such program, neither FPM will do anything even if they still raising the flag of reforms now.

If you still consider FPM as reformist party, you are mistaken my friend, long time ago, they stopped this silly activity called reforms. Letting down C.Nahas was the biggest sign of policy change. Not to mention the great reforms being done by the culture minister to protect real states companies interests.

And some FPMers like to praise Bassil and Sahnaoui work and call it reform. Both ministers are doing their job but since the one before were not doing anything, a single minor thing become big.

The word “Reform” has a big meaning and FPM work and policies are not aligned with the meaning of this word. Hariri also was considered reformist when he first came but we discovered later on that he wasn’t, worse, he was destructive.

Broken Record

Two main comments:
1) the fact that they are doing their job, per your own admission, where no one else prior to them was, is for me a major, major achievement and enough to distinguishes them from any other political party in Lebanon.
2) Doing their job means at some point having to reform the country... They tried big bangs and failed... I'm ok with trying baby steps until we get there...

The FPM (and Michel Aoun) are far from perfect... but as the French saying goes, "au royaume des aveugles, le borgne est roi"... in the kingdom of thieves, traitors and criminals, 'moderately compromising' politicians are the best solution we have...

The fact that you chose to lump them with FM, even on the dimension of 'sectarianism' (please compare the speeches of Aoun and Hariri on that, even better, of Khaled el Daher, Mou3ine Mer3abi, etc. and of Ibrahim Kan3an or whatever other FPMer) is for me an indication that you are not discussing with a genuine openness and willingness to accept facts (or what they imply)...