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How did FPM lose control of the situation so badly?

johnnyFPM

Legendary Member
Since last parliamentary elections, FPM is in a position of strength: President, biggest parliamentary bloc, numerous positions within the administration and a government with mainly allies (vs. being the “opposition” in a broader government in the previous decade).

Facts are what they are:
- Not a single significant reform was passed (before it was “ma khalouna”, now it’s ...???)
- Not a single corrupted mafioso was sent to jail
- The social and economic situation completely got out of control since last October, with not a single serious plan to tackle it
- The hate (that can’t be rationalized) towards FPM has reached unprecedented peak

FPM and its historic leader are in a coma, don’t let Bassil’s appearances on Facebook or on TV fool you.

In every single book in the world this is called complete failure and losing control of the situation. What happened with the once dynamic leadership who was always a step ahead? How can one party in which millions had so much hope turn out to be completely passive vis a vis the situation and a complete failure in governing?
 

Mrsrx

Not an expert!
Staff member
Since last parliamentary elections, FPM is in a position of strength: President, biggest parliamentary bloc, numerous positions within the administration and a government with mainly allies (vs. being the “opposition” in a broader government in the previous decade).

Facts are what they are:
- Not a single significant reform was passed (before it was “ma khalouna”, now it’s ...???)
- Not a single corrupted mafioso was sent to jail
- The social and economic situation completely got out of control since last October, with not a single serious plan to tackle it
- The hate (that can’t be rationalized) towards FPM has reached unprecedented peak

FPM and its historic leader are in a coma, don’t let Bassil’s appearances on Facebook or on TV fool you.

In every single book in the world this is called complete failure and losing control of the situation. What happened with the once dynamic leadership who was always a step ahead? How can one party in which millions had so much hope turn out to be completely passive vis a vis the situation and a complete failure in governing?
I am not sure how that happened if it is pure incompetence or something more sinister.

All i know is that the circumstances and behind closed doors dealings for GMA to be elected president were very shady. The current presidents term was built on a very bad foundation and to this day the terms of that election are not very clear and what FPM "gave up" seems to be most of their principles.
 

The_FPMer

Well-Known Member
I've said it a million times and I'll say it again, Michel Aoun and Bassil's biggest problem is not their mafia ruling the country but their massive insecure egos. FPM was built from the ground up tailored specifically to Michel Aoun. Only yes-men are allowed and promoted. No discipline within the party because it's made up of fools and opportunists. Michel Aoun never sought to improve the country's intellectual culture but rather promoted a cult of personality built around him. That had to fail at some point. The guy was outmaneuvered every time since the late 80s, and he still thinks he's smarter than everyone.
 

Resign

Well-Known Member
Orange Room Supporter
The question is what is the alternative solution?
vote LF or just no vote?
I personally will still vote FPM if no other convincing alternative is available.

Personally i follow Bkerki and i'm waiting for Rai to take an iniative and immediately
He needs to unite the Christians (people not parties) under his banner.

Our parties failed us miserably, they're all opportunists who are willing to sell us and take a dump on their principles for the chair.

we're at a very important crossroad
and if we end up very dispersed across multiple small blocs in the next election, the Christians are going to mass immigrate and disappear from Lebanon.
 

Negative

Well-Known Member
Since last parliamentary elections, FPM is in a position of strength: President, biggest parliamentary bloc, numerous positions within the administration and a government with mainly allies (vs. being the “opposition” in a broader government in the previous decade).

Facts are what they are:
- Not a single significant reform was passed (before it was “ma khalouna”, now it’s ...???)
- Not a single corrupted mafioso was sent to jail
- The social and economic situation completely got out of control since last October, with not a single serious plan to tackle it
- The hate (that can’t be rationalized) towards FPM has reached unprecedented peak

FPM and its historic leader are in a coma, don’t let Bassil’s appearances on Facebook or on TV fool you.

In every single book in the world this is called complete failure and losing control of the situation. What happened with the once dynamic leadership who was always a step ahead? How can one party in which millions had so much hope turn out to be completely passive vis a vis the situation and a complete failure in governing?
Politics is the art of compromise.
FPM compromise to improve their political position.
They don't compromise to improve the situation of the country.
They had many projects but they want them their way, and only their way. So "ma khallouna".
They had no problem to compromise to get presidency, more parliament members, and more authority in general.
This policy got them the image of incompetent politicians who have great hunger to authority.
Maybe the image doesn't reveal the true-self of FPM leaders, but it is what many people see.
 

Apostate

Your will, my hands.
Orange Room Supporter
FPM didn't lose control of the situation... rajja3o 72ou2 l masi7iye.
Proof: Michel Aoun is the president. Thats the christian rights yalle fala2o samena fiyon :p
 

dyyyy

Well-Known Member
The question is what is the alternative solution?
vote LF or just no vote?
I personally will still vote FPM if no other convincing alternative is available.
Man in democracy you don't vote for the least evil, you punish those who let you down.

if LF or FPM wins in the next elections an extra deputy or two nothing will change.

But if these parties know that you won't vote for them if they cover corruption or if they ally with Berri than things will start to change.
 

johnnyFPM

Legendary Member
The question is what is the alternative solution?
vote LF or just no vote?
I personally will still vote FPM if no other convincing alternative is available.
We are not at this question yet. Let’s focus on what went wrong first.
 

johnnyFPM

Legendary Member
I am not sure how that happened if it is pure incompetence or something more sinister.

All i know is that the circumstances and behind closed doors dealings for GMA to be elected president were very shady. The current presidents term was built on a very bad foundation and to this day the terms of that election are not very clear and what FPM "gave up" seems to be most of their principles.
They gave up way too much for a party that preached transparency, indeed. But there’s a difference between giving up and not doing much vs. not doing anything at all! They are in a coma.
 

Rafidi

Legendary Member
Since last parliamentary elections, FPM is in a position of strength: President, biggest parliamentary bloc, numerous positions within the administration and a government with mainly allies (vs. being the “opposition” in a broader government in the previous decade).

Facts are what they are:
- Not a single significant reform was passed (before it was “ma khalouna”, now it’s ...???)
- Not a single corrupted mafioso was sent to jail
- The social and economic situation completely got out of control since last October, with not a single serious plan to tackle it
- The hate (that can’t be rationalized) towards FPM has reached unprecedented peak

FPM and its historic leader are in a coma, don’t let Bassil’s appearances on Facebook or on TV fool you.

In every single book in the world this is called complete failure and losing control of the situation. What happened with the once dynamic leadership who was always a step ahead? How can one party in which millions had so much hope turn out to be completely passive vis a vis the situation and a complete failure in governing?

Your question is so defective.

To ask how did the FPM lose control of the situation is actually to assume the FPM was in control in the first place. In my view, in Lebanon (internally) no one is in absolute control. Some parties get their way some time and they dont at other times. No central authority. Not a one man show. Not a majoritarian system.
 
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elias-aj

Legendary Member
I don’t know what happened inside the party. However, and like France under the IVth Republic, Lebanon is ungovernable.

They tried to govern it through their understanding with Hariri and their alliance with HA, I thought it could work but it failed miserably. As for the economic situation, it’s a direct consequence of Hariri’s policies (the one who was killed not Saad) and the successive crisis (syrian civil war spillover, crisis between KSA and Iran with HA in the middle and less cash transfers and deposits from the gulf countries, etc.).

Yes they made mistakes, they failed but they remain the sole option in the absence of any real alternative.
 

wdawle1

Member
Man in democracy you don't vote for the least evil, you punish those who let you down.

if LF or FPM wins in the next elections an extra deputy or two nothing will change.

But if these parties know that you won't vote for them if they cover corruption or if they ally with Berri than things will start to change.

who is your alternative?

Kataeb? who controlled the country in all 1980s and led to destruction
Paula Yacoubian? Who was future movement propaganda for over 25 years, and has a house of 1.6 million by just being a reporter!
Chamel Roukoz? Who just got kicked out ?
Who?
 

GrumpForTrump

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
I don’t know what happened inside the party. However, and like France under the IVth Republic, Lebanon is ungovernable.

They tried to govern it through their understanding with Hariri and their alliance with HA, I thought it could work but it failed miserably. As for the economic situation, it’s a direct consequence of Hariri’s policies (the one who was killed not Saad) and the successive crisis (syrian civil war spillover, crisis between KSA and Iran with HA in the middle and less cash transfers and deposits from the gulf countries, etc.).

Yes they made mistakes, they failed but they remain the sole option in the absence of any real alternative.

Isn't HA to blame for the deterioration of Lebanon's ties with the West and Arab world, and the driving away of foreign investments?
 

dyyyy

Well-Known Member
who is your alternative?

Kataeb? who controlled the country in all 1980s and led to destruction
Paula Yacoubian? Who was future movement propaganda for over 25 years, and has a house of 1.6 million by just being a reporter!
Chamel Roukoz? Who just got kicked out ?
Who?
Well last time because I vote in south, i voted a white paper, precisely for the reasons I said.
White papers send a message that you might loose an election if you take the wrong decisions


But there were good alternatives in many regions : Charbel Nahas, Marc Daou, Ghassan Moukhaiber, Yahya Mawloud....

You just have to search for alternatives la2enno honestly the current ones we tried every combination and they won't work.

Tell me honestly you believe anything will change the next time if FPM gets 5 more deputies?
 

wdawle1

Member
Well last time because I vote in south, i voted a white paper, precisely for the reasons I said.
White papers send a message that you might loose an election if you take the wrong decisions


But there were good alternatives in many regions : Charbel Nahas, Marc Daou, Ghassan Moukhaiber, Yahya Mawloud....

You just have to search for alternatives la2enno honestly the current ones we tried every combination and they won't work.

Tell me honestly you believe anything will change the next time if FPM gets 5 more deputies?

Ghassan Moukhaiber was on FPM list in maten 2018 elections.
Mark Daou is pro-PSP , and directly contributed in splitting the mujtama3 madani votes into 2 lists into the benefit of Junblatt. If chouf-aley mujtama3 madani was one list they would have won a seat.
Nahas had his chance in ministry, and he chose to quit then fight.
 

dyyyy

Well-Known Member
Ghassan Moukhaiber was on FPM list in maten 2018 elections.
Mark Daou is pro-PSP , and directly contributed in splitting the mujtama3 madani votes into 2 lists into the benefit of Junblatt. If chouf-aley mujtama3 madani was one list they would have won a seat.
Nahas had his chance in ministry, and he chose to quit then fight.
Yes Ghassan Moukhaiber was on FPM list but he's someone who always proposed human right laws.

Marc Daou and Charbel Nahas are people who didn't concede. Marc Daou split moujtama3 madani because he refused the alliance with Sabaa (and he was right) and Nahas left the government because he refused to be a witness while he can't do what he promised to do.
 

Nonan

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
Yes they made mistakes, they failed but they remain the sole option in the absence of any real alternative.
To call them an option you have to have some expectation of an impact. I’d like to hear from them how they’ll achieve that impact.
I just the same yelling match with my mom trying to explain to me that ya Haram ma khallou la Aoun yshtighil.
So what? As Yoda said “ do or do not. There is no try”
 

wdawle1

Member
Yes Ghassan Moukhaiber was on FPM list but he's someone who always proposed human right laws.

Marc Daou and Charbel Nahas are people who didn't concede. Marc Daou split moujtama3 madani because he refused the alliance with Sabaa (and he was right) and Nahas left the government because he refused to be a witness while he can't do what he promised to do.

NO HE split mujtama3 madani for His boss Walid junblatt.
 

Nevermore

New Member
Since last parliamentary elections, FPM is in a position of strength: President, biggest parliamentary bloc, numerous positions within the administration and a government with mainly allies (vs. being the “opposition” in a broader government in the previous decade).

Facts are what they are:
- Not a single significant reform was passed (before it was “ma khalouna”, now it’s ...???)
- Not a single corrupted mafioso was sent to jail
- The social and economic situation completely got out of control since last October, with not a single serious plan to tackle it
- The hate (that can’t be rationalized) towards FPM has reached unprecedented peak

FPM and its historic leader are in a coma, don’t let Bassil’s appearances on Facebook or on TV fool you.

In every single book in the world this is called complete failure and losing control of the situation. What happened with the once dynamic leadership who was always a step ahead? How can one party in which millions had so much hope turn out to be completely passive vis a vis the situation and a complete failure in governing?

When did they ever have "control" of the situation? When did they ever have the capacity to send the mafiosos to jail and control the social and economic situation?

Do you really think controlling the presidency, a position with limited prerogatives, and a few ministers in governments where everyone else is against you were a vehicle for change? The assumption in participating in these dumb "taswiyet" was that the others would reciprocate in establishing reforms. That of course didn't happen, and now the country's stuck.

It's one thing to blame FPM for policy mistakes, it's another to put the burden of the country's collapse on them.
 
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