Islamophobia & anti-Semitism

Dark Angel

Dark Angel

Legendary Member
You are not responding on the same wavelength as I. Please reread what I wrote and tell me how exactly do I disagree with anything you wrote below.

What's irrational is using the above as justification for not calling attacks against innocent Muslims 'Islamophobic'. Unless you think all Muslims adhere to what this 'person' is preaching, there is no disagreement between your perspective and mine.

You don't see anyone calling bombing ISIL terrorists 'Islamophobic', do you? Why? Because they are the ones preaching hate speech, not your average Muhammad in the West who goes to work in the morning and comes home at night.

No one is arguing that the current state of Islam is peachy. And no one is saying criticism of Islam is 'Islamophobia'. Those that do are ignorant, and are incorrectly using the term, to the point of trivializing it and making it meaningless.

I'd say it is you who is saying Muslims are guilty by association, by virtue of adhering to Islam. That is what you are implying, is it not?

The absolute majority of Muslims live their life by the golden rule. Most people do, in fact, regardless of the poison pumped through scripture.
in terms of ideology, by more than one standard and on more than one level, islam is a war strategy that directly calls and incites to strike terror in the hearts of enemies and all others. in fact even its own followers are terrorized into not criticizing and into never leaving their own religion.

so being that it is an integral part of mainstream islam to strike fear in the heart of everyone, the fear of islam becomes rather a real issue and not a phobia. people should be afraid of this flavor of islam, in fact the whole world should. so you may have been intimidated, ie "terrorized" into using the term, but you should be very aware that the term serves to mask a deeper and a very dangerous and real issue that cannot be qualified as a phobia.

innocent muslims are indeed paying the price, and they will unfortunately continue to pay the price because there will always be ignorant and angry people who will consider them guilty by association, this is part of human nature and part of the world we live in. this is not specific to islam but rather it exhibits itself during all wide scale conflicts between large groups. at least muslims in the west have the luxury of living in states of laws surrounded by communities that thrive to protect the innocent from aggression regardless of their faith.

now you are arguing that pointing out the dark side of islam are used as justification for calling out more attacks on innocent muslims, you can rest assured that not pointing out and bringing attention to these deficiencies will continue to call the lives of thousands upon thousands of people around the world, especially in the middle east where the minorities have payed and continue to pay a very heave price specifically because of these warped teachings. so while using the term islamophobia may in your opinion - and this is a false assumption from your part - prevent some attacks on some individuals, the term will abstract the suffering and the crimes against all minorities in all muslim countries. there are other ways to raise awareness and protect the muslims and arabs who migrate to the west honestly seeking better lives.

so if you want to hide behind your finger, be my guest. i would rather call things by their proper names.
 
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  • Frisbeetarian

    Frisbeetarian

    Legendary Member
    It is a war the Muslims launched -- don't go crying now when six Islamic nations could not throw the Jews into the sea, as they repeatedly and unsuccessfully declared.

    Accept defeat, and move on. It's what adults do.
    Meh, you've become much less interesting. Good to note that Israelis as a whole are becoming more myopic vis a vis the region.
     
    Frisbeetarian

    Frisbeetarian

    Legendary Member
    I am glad you think so. It means Israelis are doing something right.

    #FreeKurdistan
    You haven't done anything right ever since you decided to be pawns in the hands of imperialists and the people who hate you most. Its going to come around to bite you hard but you're too myopic to see it.
     
    Muki

    Muki

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    You haven't done anything right ever since you decided to be pawns in the hands of imperialists and the people who hate you most. Its going to come around to bite you hard but you're too myopic to see it.
    Yet it is you who is whining.
     
    JB81

    JB81

    Legendary Member
    So persecuted Christians don't deserve a recognition according to @Picasso ...

    Looks like another thread to bash Christians... look how evil they are!
     
    SeaAb

    SeaAb

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    Staff member
    Super Penguin
    @HannaTheCrusader you must be the guy @ min: 1:02 - seemed quite happy to read the message! :p
     
    HannaTheCrusader

    HannaTheCrusader

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    wrong thread

    as no one hates jews like islam

    whom ever is trying to equate Islamophobia with antisemitism is like equating orcs with angels

    islam is synonymous with hate , especially anti semitism

    FGS, they call jews descendants of monkeys in the quran, what more savagery than that
     
    HannaTheCrusader

    HannaTheCrusader

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    @HannaTheCrusader you must be the guy @ min: 1:02 - seemed quite happy to read the message! :p

    not all

    only the salafis and dawaesh ones

    they are also savages, killers and vermins like creatures
     
    HannaTheCrusader

    HannaTheCrusader

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    @Frisbeetarian

    claims to be athesiust while he a shia daeshi
    that show many muslims acts

    they say something and do exactly the opposite
     
    H

    Holaco

    Well-Known Member
    Islam itself already discriminate against a lot of other minorities like Homosexuals, Athiests etc. Can atheists in iran, pakistan or suadi arabia speak his opinion publicly ? Can they publish and write books about athiesm ? NO. In fact, muslims are not even allow to change their beliefs as apostasy is punishable by law in those countries. Even in Israel, muslim citizen themselves have more freedom than what Atheists/christian have in suadi arabia

    And yet when someone "discriminate" against muslims it become huge deal these days, but no one speaks about other minorities who are discriminated.
     
    Picasso

    Picasso

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    Monsey Hanukkah Stabbing: 5 Wounded at Rabbi’s Home in N.Y. Suburb

    The governor called the violence an “act of domestic terrorism” after a suspect was arrested in Harlem.

    MONSEY, N.Y. — An intruder with a large knife burst into the home of a Hasidic rabbi in a New York suburb on Saturday night, stabbing and wounding five people just as they were gathering to light candles for Hanukkah, officials and a witness said.

    It was a terrifying scene, the officials and witness reported, saying that the violence occurred at about 10 p.m. as numerous people were celebrating Hanukkah at the home of the rabbi, Chaim Rottenberg, in Monsey, which is in an area with a large population of ultra-Orthodox Jews.

    Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo, visiting the rabbi’s home on Sunday morning, called the attack an “act of domestic terrorism.”

    The New York Police Department said a suspect had been arrested in Harlem and was turned over to the authorities in Rockland County, which is northwest of New York City and where the attack took place.

    The suspect, Grafton Thomas, 38, who is from Greenwood Lake, N.Y., near Monsey, is facing five counts of attempted murder and one count of first degree burglary. Two of the victims remained in the hospital as of Sunday morning, the police said. One victim is in critical condition with a skull fracture, according to the authorities.

    A law enforcement official said that Mr. Thomas’s vehicle was tracked to Harlem with the help of license plate readers. The patrol officers who confronted and detained Mr. Thomas found him “covered with blood,” said the official who requested anonymity because the investigation was ongoing.

    The detectives were informed that the F.B.I. and State Police were on their way to take custody of Mr. Thomas, according to the official. Mr. Thomas was then handed over.

    At his arraignment on Sunday morning, Mr. Thomas, who was wearing a white prison suit, pleaded not guilty to all charges.

    Mr. Thomas, who was initially identified by the police as Thomas Grafton, has no criminal history and is believed to have acted alone, according to the authorities.

    A witness, Aron Kohn, 65, who said he was in the rabbi’s home at the time, recalled that the rabbi was near the Hanukkah candles when the intruder stormed in.

    “I was praying for my life,” Mr. Kohn said. “He started attacking people right away as soon as he came in the door. We didn’t have time to react at all.”

    “We saw him pull a knife out of a case,” Mr. Kohn said. “It was about the size of a broomstick.”

    Mr. Kohn said that after the attacker fled, he tried to enter a synagogue next door, Congregation Netzach Yisroel, which is led by Rabbi Rottenberg.

    But people inside the synagogue apparently heard screams from the rabbi’s home and, fearful, locked the door so the attacker could not get in, Mr. Kohn said.

    Michael B. Specht, town supervisor for Ramapo, which includes Monsey, said the suspect had been arrested in New York City in the 32nd Precinct, which covers Harlem.

    Harlem is about 30 miles away from Monsey.

    “Obviously, there’s been a history in the region of violent attacks upon the Orthodox community,” Mr. Specht said. “This is something very nightmarish to have happen in our town.”

    Yossi Gestetner, a co-founder of the Orthodox Jewish Public Affairs Council, a group that covers New York and New Jersey, said one of the victims was the rabbi’s son.

    “The house had many dozens of people in there,” Mr. Gestetner said in a phone interview. “It was a Hanukkah celebration.”

    Peggy Green, a Monsey resident who is Jewish, said she was at the Evergreen Kosher Market at around 10 p.m. when she heard that there had been a stabbing nearby on Forshay Road.

    Ms. Green said the market, which is usually open until midnight on Saturdays and was busy with people shopping for Hanukkah parties, closed early.

    Ms. Green, who lives nearby, said she tried to drive near the rabbi’s home but found Forshay Road blocked off by a long line of ambulances and police cars.

    “It’s very scary,” she said, of being Jewish in Rockland County, adding that she thinks synagogues should have more armed security.

    Ed Day, county executive for Rockland County, condemned the attack.

    “Law enforcement in Rockland will leave no stone unturned as they bring those guilty of this crime to swift and severe justice,” Mr. Day said in a statement.

    Governor Cuomo said he had ordered the State Police hate crimes task force to investigate the stabbings.

    The attack came after a surge in anti-Semitic violence in the New York region. On Friday, the police in New York City stepped up patrols in three Brooklyn neighborhoods after what officials called an “alarming” increase in incidents.

    Last month, an Orthodox Jewish man was stabbed just steps away from a local synagogue as he was walking to morning prayers. The synagogue’s surveillance cameras showed a vehicle stopping near the man and then the attack on him, according to a manager there.

    No one has been charged in that attack, and officials have not determined that it was a bias crime.

    Rockland County, a collection of five towns northwest of New York City, has more than 300,000 people. About 31 percent of the population is Jewish, according to the state, and the county has one of the largest concentrations of ultra-Orthodox Jews in the country.

    The ultra-Orthodox population has surged in recent years as Hasidic families from Queens and Brooklyn, priced out of their neighborhoods, moved to the suburbs.

    “The community is terrified,” said Evan Bernstein, the New York regional director of the Anti-Defamation League, who was at the crime scene in Monsey on Saturday night. “They are very, very scared.”

    Orthodox Jews in Monsey were already rattled by recent assaults against Jews that took place in the last week in Brooklyn, as well as a deadly anti-Semitic shooting at a kosher market in Jersey City this month, he said.

    Three people, two of them Orthodox Jews, were killed at the market, which was at the center of a growing Hasidic Jewish community in Jersey City.

    Officials later declared the attack an act of domestic terrorism and said it was fueled by the assailants’ anti-Semitic beliefs.

    While officials have not yet said whether they are investigating the stabbing on Saturday night as a hate crime, Mr. Bernstein said Orthodox community members he had spoken with felt the circumstances made them feel as though they were being targeted.

    “This spate of assaults that we saw this past week was unlike anything I’ve experienced in my six and a half years at the A.D.L.,” he said. “And then, to have that really bookended with what happened in Jersey City and now, here in Monsey.”

    NYTimes
     
    NewLeb

    NewLeb

    New Member
    Monsey Hanukkah Stabbing: 5 Wounded at Rabbi’s Home in N.Y. Suburb

    The governor called the violence an “act of domestic terrorism” after a suspect was arrested in Harlem.

    MONSEY, N.Y. — An intruder with a large knife burst into the home of a Hasidic rabbi in a New York suburb on Saturday night, stabbing and wounding five people just as they were gathering to light candles for Hanukkah, officials and a witness said.

    It was a terrifying scene, the officials and witness reported, saying that the violence occurred at about 10 p.m. as numerous people were celebrating Hanukkah at the home of the rabbi, Chaim Rottenberg, in Monsey, which is in an area with a large population of ultra-Orthodox Jews.

    Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo, visiting the rabbi’s home on Sunday morning, called the attack an “act of domestic terrorism.”

    The New York Police Department said a suspect had been arrested in Harlem and was turned over to the authorities in Rockland County, which is northwest of New York City and where the attack took place.

    The suspect, Grafton Thomas, 38, who is from Greenwood Lake, N.Y., near Monsey, is facing five counts of attempted murder and one count of first degree burglary. Two of the victims remained in the hospital as of Sunday morning, the police said. One victim is in critical condition with a skull fracture, according to the authorities.

    A law enforcement official said that Mr. Thomas’s vehicle was tracked to Harlem with the help of license plate readers. The patrol officers who confronted and detained Mr. Thomas found him “covered with blood,” said the official who requested anonymity because the investigation was ongoing.

    The detectives were informed that the F.B.I. and State Police were on their way to take custody of Mr. Thomas, according to the official. Mr. Thomas was then handed over.

    At his arraignment on Sunday morning, Mr. Thomas, who was wearing a white prison suit, pleaded not guilty to all charges.

    Mr. Thomas, who was initially identified by the police as Thomas Grafton, has no criminal history and is believed to have acted alone, according to the authorities.

    A witness, Aron Kohn, 65, who said he was in the rabbi’s home at the time, recalled that the rabbi was near the Hanukkah candles when the intruder stormed in.

    “I was praying for my life,” Mr. Kohn said. “He started attacking people right away as soon as he came in the door. We didn’t have time to react at all.”

    “We saw him pull a knife out of a case,” Mr. Kohn said. “It was about the size of a broomstick.”

    Mr. Kohn said that after the attacker fled, he tried to enter a synagogue next door, Congregation Netzach Yisroel, which is led by Rabbi Rottenberg.

    But people inside the synagogue apparently heard screams from the rabbi’s home and, fearful, locked the door so the attacker could not get in, Mr. Kohn said.

    Michael B. Specht, town supervisor for Ramapo, which includes Monsey, said the suspect had been arrested in New York City in the 32nd Precinct, which covers Harlem.

    Harlem is about 30 miles away from Monsey.

    “Obviously, there’s been a history in the region of violent attacks upon the Orthodox community,” Mr. Specht said. “This is something very nightmarish to have happen in our town.”

    Yossi Gestetner, a co-founder of the Orthodox Jewish Public Affairs Council, a group that covers New York and New Jersey, said one of the victims was the rabbi’s son.

    “The house had many dozens of people in there,” Mr. Gestetner said in a phone interview. “It was a Hanukkah celebration.”

    Peggy Green, a Monsey resident who is Jewish, said she was at the Evergreen Kosher Market at around 10 p.m. when she heard that there had been a stabbing nearby on Forshay Road.

    Ms. Green said the market, which is usually open until midnight on Saturdays and was busy with people shopping for Hanukkah parties, closed early.

    Ms. Green, who lives nearby, said she tried to drive near the rabbi’s home but found Forshay Road blocked off by a long line of ambulances and police cars.

    “It’s very scary,” she said, of being Jewish in Rockland County, adding that she thinks synagogues should have more armed security.

    Ed Day, county executive for Rockland County, condemned the attack.

    “Law enforcement in Rockland will leave no stone unturned as they bring those guilty of this crime to swift and severe justice,” Mr. Day said in a statement.

    Governor Cuomo said he had ordered the State Police hate crimes task force to investigate the stabbings.

    The attack came after a surge in anti-Semitic violence in the New York region. On Friday, the police in New York City stepped up patrols in three Brooklyn neighborhoods after what officials called an “alarming” increase in incidents.

    Last month, an Orthodox Jewish man was stabbed just steps away from a local synagogue as he was walking to morning prayers. The synagogue’s surveillance cameras showed a vehicle stopping near the man and then the attack on him, according to a manager there.

    No one has been charged in that attack, and officials have not determined that it was a bias crime.

    Rockland County, a collection of five towns northwest of New York City, has more than 300,000 people. About 31 percent of the population is Jewish, according to the state, and the county has one of the largest concentrations of ultra-Orthodox Jews in the country.

    The ultra-Orthodox population has surged in recent years as Hasidic families from Queens and Brooklyn, priced out of their neighborhoods, moved to the suburbs.

    “The community is terrified,” said Evan Bernstein, the New York regional director of the Anti-Defamation League, who was at the crime scene in Monsey on Saturday night. “They are very, very scared.”

    Orthodox Jews in Monsey were already rattled by recent assaults against Jews that took place in the last week in Brooklyn, as well as a deadly anti-Semitic shooting at a kosher market in Jersey City this month, he said.

    Three people, two of them Orthodox Jews, were killed at the market, which was at the center of a growing Hasidic Jewish community in Jersey City.

    Officials later declared the attack an act of domestic terrorism and said it was fueled by the assailants’ anti-Semitic beliefs.

    While officials have not yet said whether they are investigating the stabbing on Saturday night as a hate crime, Mr. Bernstein said Orthodox community members he had spoken with felt the circumstances made them feel as though they were being targeted.

    “This spate of assaults that we saw this past week was unlike anything I’ve experienced in my six and a half years at the A.D.L.,” he said. “And then, to have that really bookended with what happened in Jersey City and now, here in Monsey.”


    NYTimes
    As populations start waking up to the immense power that Jews hold, more attacks like this will happen.

    As for “Islamophobia,” that makes no sense from an inherently Islamic perspective. The Muslim world needs to stop caring how the “Other” views them. Only then can it progress.
     
    Picasso

    Picasso

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    Orange Room Supporter
    As populations start waking up to the immense power that Jews hold, more attacks like this will happen.

    As for “Islamophobia,” that makes no sense from an inherently Islamic perspective. The Muslim world needs to stop caring how the “Other” views them. Only then can it progress.
    If they have immense power that they worked to build through generations then they have a right to it, and an attack on them is an attack on us as people who reject and despise crimes, and who detest and refuse to see a community punished and vanquished for its success and brilliance.

    Regarding Muslims, I agree that they should develop a thicker skin, but the Other is not always a bigot as the case with some Christians on this forum, the Other in its philosophical depth is you. The future you could be the other of your present self, or the mirror adjusted by the different circumstances that make you more realistic and humane, or the one who adds the missing part in many projects, aspects or aspirations of our lives, or even he could be our eyes into new depths in reading our religious scriptures. Consequently, critiques should be cherished as a new light to discover the world and our inner selves, the historical us, our collective subconsciousness, and our conditions seen from a distance that is near and far at the same time. Muslims have long since lost touch with their real and true history of treating their religion as a horizon that is always open and never to be used as a wall as the current situation is. Thus, those who are different are the waves that keep the sea alive.
     
    NewLeb

    NewLeb

    New Member
    If they have immense power that they worked to build through generations then they have a right to it, and an attack on them is an attack on us as people who reject and despise crimes, and who detest and refuse to see a community punished and vanquished for its success and brilliance.
    That may be the case if looked at it through the perspective of the conditioned self, where all worldly events are perceived and filtered through the subjective, rational mind.

    But Reality is Absolute, and Truth manifests in the culmination of trends. In the Jew’s case, the trend is a constant case of straying from the preferred way, which manifests in things like rampant usury; moral degradation (the pornography industry); ridicule of what is sacred...you get the drift. All this has invariably entailed punishment for them throughout the eras- to present.

    Regarding Muslims, I agree that they should develop a thicker skin, but the Other is not always a bigot as the case with some Christians on this forum, the Other in its philosophical depth is you. The future you could be the other of your present self, or the mirror adjusted by the different circumstances that make you more realistic and humane, or the one who adds the missing part in many projects, aspects or aspirations of our lives, or even he could be our eyes into new depths in reading our religious scriptures. Consequently, critiques should be cherished as a new light to discover the world and our inner selves, the historical us, our collective subconsciousness, and our conditions seen from a distance that is near and far at the same time. Muslims have long since lost touch with their real and true history of treating their religion as a horizon that is always open and never to be used as a wall as the current situation is. Thus, those who are different are the waves that keep the sea alive.
    I agree with all of this, however, it isn’t an issue of any real or potential bigotry. In a world where Islam is the last of the religions that still takes God seriously, it’s necessary (perhaps critical) that Muslims realize that they are different, and be completely comfortable in that. Otherwise, there can never be true progress.
     
    Picasso

    Picasso

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    The Right Response to the Anti-Semitic Attack in Monsey, N.Y.

    We need to recognize the problem for what it is: an epidemic.

    By Nita Lowey and David Harris

    In the wake of the horrific knife attack on Saturday during a Hanukkah celebration in Monsey, N.Y., and following a recent spate of other anti-Semitic assaults in New York City and elsewhere in the United States, we must ask and answer two key questions: “Why now?” and “What can be done to stop such incidents?”

    Let’s start with “Why now?” Why, when American Jews have felt unmatched levels of inclusion and equality, and when, unlike in previous generations, Jews can be found in every sphere of American society, is anti-Semitism making a comeback?
    It is important to remember that anti-Semitism has been called the world’s oldest social disease. It dates back millenniums. It has taken many forms — religious and racial, political and social. Its durability and ability to reinvent itself should never be underestimated. Even here in the United States, it never entirely vanished.

    The resurgence of anti-Semitism could be a result, in part, of the vanishing legacy of the Holocaust. Recent surveys reveal abysmal levels of knowledge among young people about what happened to the Jewish people in the Second World War. There is far too little understanding about the slippery slope from the Nazi dehumanization of the Jews in 1933 to the Final Solution nine years later.

    Social media may also be playing a role. In the past, anti-Semites lived in small ideological circles with limited reach. Now the internet amplifies the voices and influence of these otherwise marginal groups.

    Another factor could be the declining confidence in liberal democracy and its core value of pluralism. Our nation has made considerable progress in the social inclusion of minority groups. But that progress also poses a threat to those who are bewildered or angered by these social changes and who prefer mutual rancor to mutual respect.

    There’s also the “copycat” phenomenon — when someone else’s hateful actions, and the publicity they engender, spur others who seek notoriety and attention. This includes offenses like scrawling swastikas or ugly slogans on synagogue walls; assaulting people on the street in Brooklyn and Manhattan who are “identifiably” Jewish; and murdering them, as with the synagogue shootings in Pittsburgh last year and in Poway, Calif., in April, and the kosher supermarket shooting this month in Jersey City, N.J.

    Which brings us to the second of our two questions: “How to respond?”

    First, we need to recognize the problem for what it is: an epidemic. We are no longer talking about isolated, occasional actions — bad enough as those are — but a regular phenomenon. Like an epidemic, it must be treated comprehensively, addressing root causes.

    Second, we must acknowledge that there are multiple ideological sources feeding this paroxysm of hate; it is not a result of a single political outlook. Some critics wish to exploit the issue to undermine their political opponents. That is no way to deal with anti-Semitism. There is no one-size-fits-all profile for the perpetrators of these attacks.

    Third, we cannot allow this situation to become the “new normal,” as if attacks on Americans because of their religious or ethnic identities are now an expected part of our everyday lives. No, they are not. These attacks violate everything that Americans should hold dear. An attack on any American group is a threat to the pluralistic fabric of our nation.

    Fourth, despite the efforts of many elected officials and law enforcement agencies to keep us safe, more needs to be done — including enhanced information-gathering, tougher prosecution and sentencing and increased public education — to respond to anti-Semitic attacks in our communities.

    One model for community engagement is what happened in Billings, Mont., in 1993, after a year of racist and anti-Semitic incitements that culminated with the throwing of a brick through the bedroom window of a young child in a Jewish home that had a menorah on display. The reaction of Billings was swift and decisive. Under the leadership of the police chief and a newspaper editor, paper cutouts of a menorah were made widely available. Thousands of households in Billings put them in their windows. The message was clear: Anti-Semitism and racism had no place there.

    In a survey of American Jews by the American Jewish Committee, released in October, 31 percent of respondents said that they had taken steps to hide their Jewish identity in public, while 25 percent said that they now avoided Jewish sites. And this survey was conducted before the recent attacks in Jersey City and Monsey.

    This is unacceptable. It is not our America. We call on all Americans of good will to ask ourselves how each of us can defend our inclusive vision for this country.

    NYTimes
     
    Picasso

    Picasso

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    Muslims Should Disarm Islamophobia With Kindness

    By Mustafa Akyol


    The Quran has many verses that command a courteous response to even a terrible insult to Islam.

    Until the night of Jan. 18, Mila Orriols, a 16-year-old lesbian and atheist schoolgirl from southern France, probably did not expect to initiate a national controversy. But that is what happened when she live-streamed herself on Instagram while applying makeup, only to get into a quarrel with a man who, in her words, began “hitting on her heavily.” The online fight soon turned into matters of identity, and at some point the angry Mila said, “the Quran is a religion of hatred,” and used a vile vulgarity to describe Islam.

    The very fact that she defined the Quran as “a religion” was a sign that Mila was not in touch with Islamic theology. (The Quran is the holy book of Islam, the religion). Yet still, her comment, which quickly spread on social media, was taken seriously by many French Muslims, some of whom reacted with anger. “I receive 200 messages of hate each minute,” Mila said, before she was put under police protection against death threats and went into hiding.

    Since then, the Mila affair has become a national controversy in France, with numerous media stories, comments from President Emmanuel Macron, Justice Minister Nicole Belloubet, and the far-right leader Marine Le Pen. Countless Twitter posts adopted the hashtag JeSuisMila# (“I am Mila”), evoking #JeSuisCharlie, the motto for supporting the satirical magazine Charlie Hebdo after Islamist terrorists claiming ties to Al Qaeda in 2015 attacked its office and murdered 12 people.

    In other words, the Mila affair has become yet another episode in an oft-repeated pattern: A Westerner mocks or openly demeans Islam, often labeling it as a harsh, intolerant and violent religion. In return, some Muslims have harsh, intolerant or even violent reactions — without realizing that they only seem to confirm the accusation.

    Of course, not all Muslims agree with this knee-jerk reaction; many simply prefer to stay silent. But while silence does not exacerbate the problem, it doesn’t solve it either. Other Muslims seek a response in identity politics, by slamming all critics of Islam as racists. But that best-defense-is-offense approach also doesn’t help much, nor does its premise — that Muslims are a race, which is not very accurate.

    Here is what we Muslims should see: A very negative view of Islam, often called Islamophobia, is now a real, even lethal, problem in the world. In part, it derives from factors beyond our control — nativism in the West, Hindu supremacy in India or totalitarianism in China. But it is also caused by factors within us — the justification of many terrible deeds in the name of Islam today, from terrorism to tyranny, from patriarchy to bigotry. It is only normal that some non-Muslims are shocked by these wrongdoings, and judge Islam accordingly.

    In return, it is mainly our duty to clean up our house, challenge the harsh interpretations of our faith and also build alliances with all the good-willed people who are committed to protecting human rights. Just last week, the German justice minister indicated that her country would do its part when she declared that far-right terrorists are Germany’s No. 1 threat. That statement came after a right-wing gunman with racist views killed nine mostly young people in a hookah bar in the city of Hanau.

    Moreover, we should respond to Islamophobia in a way that will not reinforce it, but rather disarm it.

    The answer is right there in the Quran.

    First, the Quran warns us against what unfortunately has become a dominant mood in the contemporary Muslim public sphere: anger. Verse 3:134 defines good Muslims, rather, as “those who restrain their anger and who forgive people.” Other verses also praise prophets such as Abraham, Isaac and Shuaib for having hilm, a moral virtue that implies forbearance, gentleness and forgiveness.

    In verse 16:125, the Quran also explains how hilm must be practiced when Muslims are in conversation with others:

    “Call to the way of your Lord with wisdom and good teaching. Argue with them in the most courteous way … .”

    In another verse, 41:34, the Quran goes even further, advising what we today call “killing with kindness”:

    “Good and evil cannot be equal. Repel evil with what is better and your enemy will become as close as an intimate friend.”

    So, in the light of these verses, the Muslim reaction against Islamophobia should be calm and gentle, and “in the most courteous way.” Muslims should even go out of their way to win the hearts and minds of those who seem hostile.

    One reason this doesn’t happen often enough is that the verses quoted above have not fully defined the Islamic perspective on engagement with non-Muslims. The Quran also has verses commanding war against “unbelievers” until they are converted or subdued. In medieval Islam, these belligerent verses were taken as the pivotal ones by the mainstream jurisprudential tradition, which unmistakably grew under conquest-hungry empires. This tradition even explicitly “abrogated” more than a hundred Quranic verses that preached civility, including the ones just quoted above — 16:125 and 41:34.

    Worse than that, medieval Muslim jurists invented severe blasphemy laws to punish anyone who insulted Islam. Among these jurists were the 48 Christians of Cordoba who, in the mid-ninth century, publicly defamed the Prophet Muhammad, only to be beheaded for it. Clearly, killing with kindness was gone, and replaced by killing with the sword.

    Today, the verdicts behind such grim episodes still inspire extremists in the Muslim world. However, we, the reasonable Muslims, don’t have to blindly abide by medieval jurisprudence. We can take peace, not war, as the normal state of human affairs. Similarly, we can defend our faith not with the dictates of power, but the appeals of reason and virtue.

    With that in mind, if I were a Muslim leader in France, here is how I would respond to Mila: I would send her a kind letter filled with hilm. “We respect your freedom of speech, and regret the hate poured on you,” it would read. “But ours is really a religion of compassion, not hate.” I would also add a helpful introductory book on Islam, and even a nice bouquet of flowers.

    Perhaps then, the young Mila Orriols would see Islam in a brighter light. And with her, the rest of French society, and maybe even the broader modern world.

    Mustafa Akyol (@akyolinenglish) is a senior fellow on Islam and modernity at the Cato Institute, and the author of “Islam Without Extremes: A Muslim Case for Liberty.”


    NYTimes
     
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    illusion84

    Member
    while thousands of articles have been written about the "execution" of galileo, the world knows close to nothing about the pride of the golden age arab scientists how they lived and how they were killed and why. in order to determine whether the defensiveness against islamic masses is warranted or not, their whole psyche should be critically analyzed.

    for instance, in this very thread the islamic golden age was praised, by people who learned to parrot things out without any veracity, in conformity with the whole arabic culture.

    so let's put that golden age to the test, and follow through all the major names that islamists and arabs resort when they want to reminisce over a golden age that exists only in their imagination.

    so let's take these so called "muslim" philosophers and scientists, and examine their cases, one by one, and examine their views of islam, it seems that in their majority they did not hold a kind view of islam; but let's examine their views, their lives and their death, this way your serious academic study will have more merit and credibility in the western meaning of the terms.

    so let's start with ibn el muqafa3.

    ibn el muqafa3 captured alive, tied to a pole, his members cut to pieces one by one, cooked, and he was forced to eat them shortly before he died from pain and despair.

    هو عبد الله بن المقفع، فارسي الأصل، وُلِد في قرية بفارس اسمها جور، مؤرخون أخرون ينسبون مولده للبصرة، كان إسمه روزبه پور دادویه (روزبه بن داذویه)، وكنيته "أبا عمرو"، فلما أسلم تسمى بعبد الله وتكنى بأبي محمد ولقب والده بالمقفع لأنه أُتهِم بِمّدَ يده وسرق من أموال المسلمين والدولة الإسلامية لِذا نكّل بِه الحجاج بن يوسف الثقفي وعاقبه فضربه على أصابع يديه حتى تشنجتا وتقفعتا (أي تورمتا وإعوجت أصابعهما ثم شُلِتا). وقال ابن خلكان في تفسيره: كان الحجاج بن يوسف الثقفي في أيام ولايته العراق وبلاد فارس قد ولى داذويه خراج فارس، فمد يده واخذ الأموال. فعذبه فتفقعت يده فقيل له المقفع[3]، وقيل انه سمي بالمقفع لأنه يعمل في القفاع[3] ويبيعها، ولكن الرأي الأول هو الشائع والمعروف وعلى أساسه عرف روزبه بابن المقفع[4].

    نشأ ابن المقفع على المجوسية على مذهب المانوية وكان له نشاط في نشر تعاليمها وترجمتها إلى العربية، ومنها كتاب في سيرة مزدك أحد دعاة الثنوية ومن زعمائها المجددين لمبادئها. حتى أسلم على يد عيسى بن علي، فتغير اسمه لعبدالله وتكنى بأبي محمد، ولم تطل فترة اسلامه اذ قتل على يد سفيان بن معاوية بن يزيد بن الملهب بإيعاز من المنصورمتهماً بالزندقة، حيث كانت مبررات قتله على انه زنديق من الفئة التي تتظاهر بالإسلام مراءاة وخداعاً. ولكن ليس في آثار بن المقفع مايدل على زندقته، ولم يكن هنالك دليل مادي يوجه اتهامات إليه لإثبات زندقته وتبرير قتله، فالزندقة ليست السبب الحقيقي لمقتله وإنما كانت للتغطيه[4]. بالرغم من ذلك فإن احتمالية كونه زنديقاً بعد اسلامه امر محتمل، فيشير بعض المؤرخين بأن اسلامه ماكان إلا ليحافظ على كرامته وطمعاً في الشهرة والجاه وتقرباً إلى مواليه العباسيين[5].

    his death, in this account they omit to say he was forced to eat pieces of his own body.

    بعد ذلك ربطه وآمر بإحضار فرن تنور فَسجَّره وأوقده حتى أصبح حامياً مُتوّقداً عندئذٍ آمر سفيان رجاله بِتقطيع أعضاء وأطراف عبد الله بن المقفع عضواً عضواً وكُلما قطعوا عضواً من جسم إبن المقفع يقول لهم سفيان بن معاوية:
    «ألقوه وأرموه في النار».
    فجعل رجال سفيان يقطعون أعضاؤه ثم يرمونها في الفرن حتى تحترق بينما يرى وينظر لها عبد الله بن المقفع حتى هلك ومات من شدة التعذيب.

    so should we count ibn el mouqafa3 as a part of the golden age of arabs/islam or not? i guess not. especially that he seems to have been neither an arab nor a muslem.

    a new icon of the islamic/arabic golden age coming soon, just for you :)

    but on the side, between you and me, do you think ibn el muqafa3 was an islamophobe?

    unfortunately, this how most of the people we are dealing with would recount his story, ah the golden age was great, ibn el mouqafa3 was a pillar without which there would have been no european civilization, unfortunately he was invited over to lunch with the caliphate, and he died while eating cooked meet. that's precisely what we are dealing with here :)
    It seems a personal feuds for me, it doesn't help your case against Islamophobia...

    Anyway we live in a majority Muslim country; so what should we do ? fear muslim neighbours and fled the country or what? Start a war?

    I don't get what's your take on it!
     
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    illusion84

    Member
    Muslims Should Disarm Islamophobia With Kindness

    By Mustafa Akyol


    The Quran has many verses that command a courteous response to even a terrible insult to Islam.

    Until the night of Jan. 18, Mila Orriols, a 16-year-old lesbian and atheist schoolgirl from southern France, probably did not expect to initiate a national controversy. But that is what happened when she live-streamed herself on Instagram while applying makeup, only to get into a quarrel with a man who, in her words, began “hitting on her heavily.” The online fight soon turned into matters of identity, and at some point the angry Mila said, “the Quran is a religion of hatred,” and used a vile vulgarity to describe Islam.
    Picasso it doesn't really matter what Islam or what the Quran or what Mohammed say that you should do; what really matters are the actions of Muslims!

    Once I was reading an Islamic Shia website; and in it there is a great story about Imam Ali and how his followers brought him an individual that used to insult him.

    The followers asked Imam Ali permission to kill the person accused with insulting; Imam Ali response was that I can not physically harm someone that did not physically harm me! Basically letting him go and showing mercy and even a historic acceptance of freedom of speech.

    Anyway the Shia site goes on; and argue that Imam Ali 's action are not to be repeated nowadays and if someone insults the Imams he must be killed :eek:

    Don't ask me how they came up to this judgement and I can't really bring you the source; this was an article that I've read more than 5 years ago but it shocked me and I would never forget it...

    I understand that many people are against Islam as a religion; and this simply comes from the behaviour of Islamic leaders worldwide.

    But it is much more complicated than that; most muslim countries are third world countries and they should be compared to non Islamic third world country to to Europe.

    Plus Muslim countries still suffer the implication of imperialism and foreign interference beside the political problems caused by dictatorship; lack of education; and in some part foreign occupation.
     
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