Lebanese is a language (derived from syriac) not a dialect

Ice Tea

Ice Tea

Active Member
From someone that claims knowledge and superiority of being the propagandist of lies about the Ismalic and Chrustian history, your lack of knowledge about what you are talking about was already revealed in the fatal mistake you made in the post where you assumed that Syriac was Eastern Aramaic. This is to say that you did not even know that Eastern Aramaic comes from Iraq and Western Aramaic comes from Syriac.

Now that you read the text I gave you to avoid furthure embarassement of your posts you really had the courage to write this other unfounded and basless theory which seems to have come from the top of your head.

Syriac is an Eastern Aramaic language, It's closest relatives are Assyrian/Chaldean and Turoyo which Assyrians speak, all Eastern Aramaic dialects. It's not vernacular anymore, and used mostly liturgically.

Syriac language - Wikipedia

Eastern Aramaic languages - Wikipedia

The variety of Aramaic spoken in the Levant was Western Aramaic, which is not mutually intelligible with Syriac/Eastern. Syriac was used mostly liturgically in the Levant.

People in Maaloula speak Western Neo-Aramaic. Which is the variety probably closest to the one once spoken in Lebanon.

Western Neo-Aramaic - Wikipedia

Othe Western Aramaic languages are all extinct.

Western Aramaic languages - Wikipedia
 
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  • Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Syriac is an Eastern Aramaic language, It's closest relatives are Assyrian/Chaldean and Turoyo which Assyrians speak, all Eastern Aramaic dialects. It's not vernacular anymore, and used mostly liturgically.

    Syriac language - Wikipedia

    Eastern Aramaic languages - Wikipedia

    The variety of Aramaic spoken in the Levant was Western Aramaic, which is not mutually intelligible with Syriac/Eastern. Syriac was used mostly liturgically in the Levant.

    People in Maaloula speak Western Neo-Aramaic. Which is the variety probably closest to the one once spoken in Lebanon.

    Western Neo-Aramaic - Wikipedia

    Othe Western Aramaic languages are all extinct.

    Western Aramaic languages - Wikipedia
    OK
     
    R

    Ralph N

    Active Member
    In the beginning there was Aramaic, and then was created arabic...

    The language if Jesus... Aramaic....arabic and hebrew came from Aramaic.
     
    Mighty Goat

    Mighty Goat

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Ok? You claimed I was embarrassed, when you were clearly the one embarrassing yourself. I like you, but many of the things you post are historically inaccurate.
    I provided a source in my post and my source is accurate, You are insitsing on being wrong which demonstrates a culture that has resistence to learning and consequently un-intellegint. T
     
    Lebmonage

    Lebmonage

    Legendary Member
    In Lebanon, no one sect is homogenous.

    With a sect, you find people from different ethnic origins. Among Maronite Christians, the Hashem family are sayyids- descendants of the Prophet Muhammad. There are Maronites who have Jewish descent and Canaanite descent etc. This is the same reality for all Lebanese communities. Going back into history to trace our ethnic nationalities and our descent from then becomes burdensome. We are a people who reflect all those who settled on this land. And today we speak Arabic because the last people to come and rule us left the greatest mark and left their language.

    no single sect in Lebanon has single ancestral line or is ethnically homogenous. Within a sect, you'd find families descended from different ethnic ancestries or nationalities and from different religious origins. For example, Druze pride themselves with Arabism. Yet, their number one leader today, Jumblatt has Kurdish ancestry.

    Let us be happy with our Lebanese identity and forget the many lines we descended from, including the indigenous one(s) to Lebanon and the immigrant ones into Lebanon. That's what makes us Lebanese.
     
    Walidos

    Walidos

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    I don’t know why everybody’s got their panties in a twist... languages evolve and some dialects become languages with enough variations... so modern Lebanese is a mixture of Arabic and Aramaic ways of speaking and written with Arabic letters... we even have a Lebanese alphabet written by saiid akl, and we write Arabic with the western alphabet ... not to mention using french and English words with a Lebanese twist... doesn’t make us more or less Arabs, more or less Phoenicians or more or less special!
     
    CitizenOfTheRepublic

    CitizenOfTheRepublic

    Legendary Member
    I don’t know why everybody’s got their panties in a twist... languages evolve and some dialects become languages with enough variations... so modern Lebanese is a mixture of Arabic and Aramaic ways of speaking and written with Arabic letters... we even have a Lebanese alphabet written by saiid akl, and we write Arabic with the western alphabet ... not to mention using french and English words with a Lebanese twist... doesn’t make us more or less Arabs, more or less Phoenicians or more or less special!
    It definitely does not make you more or less Phoenician, speaking Arabic is completely irrelevant to our ancestral lineage.

    That said, the definition of being an "Arab" seems to rely quite heavily on the language you speak among other things. So exposing how different our language is from Arabic does ruffle quite a few feathers. For me it doesn't change much really, I always did not consider myself and Arab but fully acknowledge its influence on my culture.
     
    B

    Beth_Ansho

    New Member
    Syriac is, in fact, quite versatile. You have one letter that could represent both a "P" and an "F" sound, as well as a letter that could represent a "B" sound and a "V" sound simultaneously. No need to introduce Western phonological/linguistic modalities into a lexicon that is in essence Eastern.
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    Why do many Lebanese think the Phoenicians spoke Syriac? 🤦‍♂️

    Phoenicians spoke Canaanite. If someone wants to learn the language of the Phoenicians they should simply learn Hebrew. Hebrew is merely the name the Israelites gave to the language they spoke, the Canaanite language, to distance themselves from the polytheist Canaanites they emerged from. The Israelites themselves were Canaanites who branched out when they became monotheist. As far as I know modern Hebrew is very similar to Biblical Hebrew, which is the same Canaanite language the Phoenicians spoke.


    By the time of Jesus, the Canaanite language aka Hebrew was only spoken by Jewish Rabbis, who preserved the language until it was revived when modern Israel was founded. The general population had adopted Aramaic, which was the language of the land until the barbaric and violent Arab Muslim invasion.

    People nowadays use 'Syriac' as an umbrella term for the various neo-Aramaic dialects spoken by the native Christians of the Levant and Iraq. Eastern Aramaic is spoken by the Assyrians/Chaldeans, Western Aramaic is still spoken in places like Maaloula. Things get more complicated when Classical/Liturgical Syriac is actually EASTERN Aramaic. Levantine Christians used it only liturgically (Maronites still do) but the language they spoke was Western Aramaic, like the one in Maaloula. So if we want to learn and speak the language of our ancestors, it is Western Aramaic, not Classical Syriac (Eastern Aramaic).
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    Chaldean Aramaic, even tho Eastern Aramaic, sounds VERY close to the Western Aramaic spoken in Maaloula. It sounds less Hebrew than Assyrian Aramaic and less Arabic than Turoyo Aramaic.

     
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    Beth_Ansho

    New Member
    People nowadays use 'Syriac' as an umbrella term for the various neo-Aramaic dialects spoken by the native Christians of the Levant and Iraq. Eastern Aramaic is spoken by the Assyrians/Chaldeans, Western Aramaic is still spoken in places like Maaloula.
    There's nothing wrong with using the term "Syriac". It is the name of the churches that have preserved the use of the language. Much like the distinctions with the different versions of Hebrew, it's important to make distinctions between the different versions of Aramaic. Syriac simply indicates that the language is a unifying ecclesiastical language for most Christians in the Levant, Southern Anatolia, and other parts of the Middle East.

    Things get more complicated when Classical/Liturgical Syriac is actually EASTERN Aramaic. Levantine Christians used it only liturgically (Maronites still do) but the language they spoke was Western Aramaic, like the one in Maaloula. So if we want to learn and speak the language of our ancestors, it is Western Aramaic, not Classical Syriac (Eastern Aramaic).
    Not ONLY liturgically, there's plenty of evidence that Syriac was used as a literary language, too. Maronites and others used it and Garshuneh for calendars and record keeping.

    What you've stated sounds like the Assyrian argument, which seeks to lay ownership over all things Syriac. History says otherwise.
     
    Ice Tea

    Ice Tea

    Active Member
    There's nothing wrong with using the term "Syriac". It is the name of the churches that have preserved the use of the language. Much like the distinctions with the different versions of Hebrew, it's important to make distinctions between the different versions of Aramaic. Syriac simply indicates that the language is a unifying ecclesiastical language for most Christians in the Levant, Southern Anatolia, and other parts of the Middle East.



    Not ONLY liturgically, there's plenty of evidence that Syriac was used as a literary language, too. Maronites and others used it and Garshuneh for calendars and record keeping.

    What you've stated sounds like the Assyrian argument, which seeks to lay ownership over all things Syriac. History says otherwise.
    I know. I just stated that Syriac as a language is actually Eastern Aramaic. It developed from the spoken language in the Tur Abdin/Southern Turkey area. Western Aramaic was the spoken language of the Levant. And Melkite Aramaic aka Palestinian Christian Aramaic, also Western Aramaic, was the liturgical language of the Rûm Church. The fact that Maronites use classical Syriac (eastern Aramaic) and not Melkite Aramaic (Western Aramaic) as their liturgical language also proves that proto-Maronites came from Northern Syria/Southern Turkey area.
     
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    Beth_Ansho

    New Member
    The fact that Maronites use classical Syriac (eastern Aramaic) and not Melkite Aramaic (Western Aramaic) as their liturgical language also proves that proto-Maronites came from Northern Syria/Southern Turkey area.
    Do you have sources for any of this information? First time I hear that Maronites came from Northern Syria/Southern Anatolia and use Eastern Syriac liturgically. All Syriac/Aramaic came from Southern Anatolia and spread throughout the Levant and even further east and most of the people who used the language were indigenous to the region, like the Assyrians. It spread despite social and political changes, not because of demographic changes.
     
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