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The French Initiative [Saad Hariri renamed as PM]

My Moria Moon

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
You were dangling the Cairo Agreeement.

The Southerners ended the PLO military presence in the South,
🤪

The southerners threw rice on the Israelis Merkavas when they came in to end the PLO military presence.:happy:

when you admitted the state handed our villages to the PLO domination. When Israehell too refused to leave, the Southerners drove out the Israehelli occupation. The Israehelli occupation lasted longer than the PLO occupation. You have to explain why.

I swear, not even you can make sense out of what you wrote up there 👆
 

agnostic

Legendary Member
Bel 3akes I thank you for your serious answer above, but I had nothing to reply to.

Bas if YHWH got in a fight for primacy with Allah, who would win? That's a legitimate question.

Ask the question first for the Christians since AFAIK you are not Atheist. Do you worship Allah, YHWH or a totally different god?
 

Rafidi

Legendary Member
🤪

The southerners threw rice on the Israelis Merkavas when they came in to end the PLO military presence.:happy:

That is a stupid generalisation. If few or even tens of southerners did out of frustration with the PLO, that by no way was representative of all southerners.

But let's accept your generalization. Let me agree to that and even add and say "all southerners welcomed the Israehelli visitors". Why did the Israehelli "visitors" overstay their welcome? You've still not answered.

I swear, not even you can make sense out of what you wrote up there 👆

I cant help you think nor can i force you to understand. I know of no market where i can buy a brain to send you one. Even if there is, brain transplant is not yet possible. Too bad.
 

My Moria Moon

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
That is a stupid generalisation. If few or even tens of southerners did out of frustration with the PLO, that by no way was represetative of all southerners.

But let accept your generalization. Let me agree that and even add and say "all southerners welcomed the Israehelli visitors". Why did the Israehellis overstay their welcome? You've still not answered.

Told you already several times in several posts, in this thread: Because they ARE E V I L EEEEEEEVIL.
And HA kicked the EEEEEEViL out, 20 years ago.
Baddak a7san men hek. Le7e2ne "answer this..." as if this is something you've built your entire forum nafir on.


I cant help you think nor can i force you to understand. I know of no market where i can buy a brain to send you one. Even if there is, brain transplant is not yet possible. Too bad.

:happy:

Send me yours 2eza ma fi te2le, you don't seem to use it much and our lab is experimenting on brain implants for Dolphins.
 

Rafidi

Legendary Member
Told you already several times in several posts, in this thread: Because they ARE E V I L EEEEEEEVIL.
And HA kicked the EEEEEEViL out, 20 years ago.
Baddak a7san men hek. Le7e2ne "answer this..." as if this is something you've built your entire forum nafir on.




:happy:

Send me yours 2eza ma fi te2le, you don't seem to use it much and our lab is experimenting on brain implants for Dolphins.

A completely pointless post. You refuse to answer the relevant question. You dont want to admit the obvious that Israehell is an occupation entity and if it was not rejected and resisted, it would have stayed on. We still have occupied Lebanese lands to this day. Why doesnt Israehell just leave and prove how much peace loving they are? But of course, that is not important to you.
 

My Moria Moon

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
A completely pointless post. You refuse to answer the relevant question.
Which same relevant question I already answered 10 times? Ask me again.

You dont want to admit the obvious that Israehell is an occupation entity and if it was not rejected and resisted, it would have stayed on.

Qasaman billah I admit what you say is 100% true, every single world of it. wa ba3d..

Israehell invaded and occupied during the civil war, in the absence of a state and an army and because the PLO was occupying our land.
Before that, it did not invade nor occupy.
After it was kicked out 20 years ago, we had at least the shadow of a state and an army, however under Syrian occupation.
But HA, empowered by the Syrian occupation army, did not allow for the Lebanese army to go back south and shoulder its duties.
Come 2005.
Syria's occupation army left.
Still no Israeli occupation, no invasion and no LA.
Only HA.
Come 2006.
HA ignites war with Israel for Samir Quntar.
Divine HA defeat. Lebanon in ruins.
Israel Hits and Runs.
Still no occupation.
HA/Amal begging for LA and UNIFIL deployment.
HA now pushed behind Litani.
15 years later.
That is Now.
Still No Israeli Occupation Nor Invasion.
LA in the south.
WTF are HA weapons still doing?



We still have occupied Lebanese lands to this day.

Then ask HA to go liberate those lands. What are they waiting for? Either they do or you stop using them as an excuse for you to advocate for their useless arms.

Better yet: how about you leave it to the Lebanese government together with Syria to first agree on the ownership of those lands?

Wallah, no, ma fi majel, your brains do not switch to completely unknown waves.

Why doesnt Israehell just leave and prove how much peace loving they are? But of course, that is not important to you.

I think I need to remind myself that parallel universes do indeed exist and that I occasionally slip into one where you exist. Nice to meet you again @Rafidi.

How about you read my above replies so that when I visit you again, we can proceed from where we left. That is square one. :lol:
 
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The Bidenator

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
@My Moria Moon just give @Rafidi what he's asking for already. Tell him Israel stayed in South Lebanon because of foreign sponsored terrorists and left (prematurely I may say) because Ehud Barak is an idiot who wanted to win an election. Instead, he became irrelevant. Nevertheless, in 2006 the Lebanese Army made its way South. Next is liberating South Lebanon from the Iranian occupation, preferably before they liberate Lebanon from its Lebanese identity.
 

HalaMadrid

Well-Known Member
Orange Room Supporter
because in (responsible) politics, you maintain bridges. dont get too taken by the thawra slogans, this is idealistic. unless people are willing and able to jail someone like Hariri you have to work with him eventually. So while it is ok to call out issues and disagree in politics, calling him a liar publicly (even if via a leaked video) makes it personal and very difficult to recover. same as the bassil baltaje comment that was very true but he had to go and make up with Berri (its easier for Bassil as Berri is house speaker while he is an MP, more difficult for GMA as he is the President) same as the joumblat jens 3atel comment, unacceptable.
Yeah, I guess I have a different theory of politics, particularly under circumstances where you need structural change. I don't think you maintain bridges with folks you've tried that with time and time again only for them to burn those bridges and then galavant around the world trying to burn you politically and then orchestrate media campaigns to that effect. I think under those circumstances you try to win. You maintain bridges with groups who have shown a willingness for some measures of partnership (I have my many criticisms of HA, but they remain the only ones--aside from steadfast FPM allies--who this could be said about). I thought it refreshing to see Aoun go on the offensive with (what I assume is) a targeted leak.

The Jumblatt comment is not the same as the other two. When Berri or Hariri become immutable characteristics of a group of people, I'll revise my understanding of both incidents.

And to add: I also think after all this time, the more you accommodate and play nice, the more you're going to get roped into "well you're the same as them, well you voted for them, well you kept riad salame on etc etc." Damned if you do and don't, imo it's riskier, but more politically shrewd to play with the same fire they've been playing with.
 
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Walidos

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
Yeah, I guess I have a different theory of politics, particularly under circumstances where you need structural change. I don't think you maintain bridges with folks you've tried that with time and time again only for them to burn those bridges and then galavant around the world trying to burn you politically and then orchestrate media campaigns to that effect. I think under those circumstances you try to win. You maintain bridges with groups who have shown a willingness for some measures of partnership (I have my many criticisms of HA, but they remain the only ones--aside from steadfast FPM allies--who this could be said about). I thought it refreshing to see Aoun go on the offensive with (what I assume is) a targeted leak.

The Jumblatt comment is not the same as the other two. When Berri or Hariri become immutable characteristics of a group of people, I'll revise my understanding of both incidents.

And to add: I also think after all this time, the more you accommodate and play nice, the more you're going to get roped into "well you're the same as them, well you voted for them, well you kept riad salame on etc etc." Damned if you do and don't, imo it's riskier, but more politically shrewd to play with the same fire they've been playing with.
You are getting played by the thawra rhetoric, this won’t get you anywhere. This is politics and politics are dirty. You think if you go on the offensive that you will gain the respect of the idiots who were saying “you’re the same as them”. No one will give you any slack. you play nice in the media and you fight them where they cannot attack. Learn a move or two from the HA book: in the media they portray themselves as angels. They say all the right things, butter up everybody. Min ta7t la ta7t they take control of MoF, they screw the fight against corruption to maintain Berri, they play the victim. All the media and thawra foufesh activists go after Bassil...! FPM and GMA need to be significantly smarter...! Otherwise they will always be on the backfoot defending some silly position they took or that was leaked.
 

SeaAb

Legendary Member
Staff member
Super Penguin
@My Moria Moon just give @Rafidi what he's asking for already. Tell him Israel stayed in South Lebanon because of foreign sponsored terrorists and left (prematurely I may say) because Ehud Barak is an idiot who wanted to win an election. Instead, he became irrelevant. Nevertheless, in 2006 the Lebanese Army made its way South. Next is liberating South Lebanon from the Iranian occupation, preferably before they liberate Lebanon from its Lebanese identity.
 

HalaMadrid

Well-Known Member
Orange Room Supporter
You are getting played by the thawra rhetoric, this won’t get you anywhere. This is politics and politics are dirty. You think if you go on the offensive that you will gain the respect of the idiots who were saying “you’re the same as them”. No one will give you any slack. you play nice in the media and you fight them where they cannot attack. Learn a move or two from the HA book: in the media they portray themselves as angels. They say all the right things, butter up everybody. Min ta7t la ta7t they take control of MoF, they screw the fight against corruption to maintain Berri, they play the victim. All the media and thawra foufesh activists go after Bassil...! FPM and GMA need to be significantly smarter...! Otherwise they will always be on the backfoot defending some silly position they took or that was leaked.
But...I'm the one that's arguing for dirty politics? lol. Exactly like calling him out in public for being a liar.

Believe me, I'm under no illusions from the political incompetence of sawra rhetoric. I don't think that rejecting Hariri or Berri or whoever is going to ingratiate Aoun with "sawra" or "mmfd" or whatever. They're not the target for this anyway.

HA can do what they do because they have done because the other parties will bend over backwards to accommodate them in private when push comes to shove. This is not true of FPM, which is why while they have to be more strategic in spots (I agree with you they're definitely not always), they also have to go on the offensive in public. They don't have the luxury of portraying themselves in the media one way and then doing something else behind closed doors. They don't control the media environment, their adversaries do, so they are relentlessly attacked for anything they do min ta7t la ta7t. Their only option is to manipulate the media environment in their favor--like the leak. I think for the very first time since maybe 2009 (?) this week Bassil and GMA went on the offensive.
 

Walidos

Legendary Member
Orange Room Supporter
But...I'm the one that's arguing for dirty politics? lol. Exactly like calling him out in public for being a liar.

Believe me, I'm under no illusions from the political incompetence of sawra rhetoric. I don't think that rejecting Hariri or Berri or whoever is going to ingratiate Aoun with "sawra" or "mmfd" or whatever. They're not the target for this anyway.

HA can do what they do because they have done because the other parties will bend over backwards to accommodate them in private when push comes to shove. This is not true of FPM, which is why while they have to be more strategic in spots (I agree with you they're definitely not always), they also have to go on the offensive in public. They don't have the luxury of portraying themselves in the media one way and then doing something else behind closed doors. They don't control the media environment, their adversaries do, so they are relentlessly attacked for anything they do min ta7t la ta7t. Their only option is to manipulate the media environment in their favor--like the leak. I think for the very first time since maybe 2009 (?) this week Bassil and GMA went on the offensive.
Leaking liar is not dirty politics, it is saying things as they are 😂 dirty politics would be answering the question”shou, fi te2lif?” By “walla 3am min jarrib, 3ateyna il sheikh Saad ktir bass baddo aktar... walla 3am jarrib se3do bass ma ba3rif leish kil ma na3ti byotlob aktar... ma ka2anno baddo yshakil ma ba3rif” and leak that... he looks good and the media frenzy is about Saad...! It is also meeting the rhetoric of FPM... instead now the frenzy is how he called saad kezzeb... add to that Saad is personally humiliated so much tougher to move forward. In politics you defeat someone by a thousand cuts, not by crushing them, that’s what happens in wars.
 

Rafidi

Legendary Member
@My Moria Moon just give @Rafidi what he's asking for already. Tell him Israel stayed in South Lebanon because of foreign sponsored terrorists and left (prematurely I may say) because Ehud Barak is an idiot who wanted to win an election. Instead, he became irrelevant. Nevertheless, in 2006 the Lebanese Army made its way South. Next is liberating South Lebanon from the Iranian occupation, preferably before they liberate Lebanon from its Lebanese identity.

An Zionist [...] wants to "liberate" Lebanon. Liberate yourself from blindness.

If you say Israehell stayed in the South because of...Palestinians were no more in the South. Why didnt you leave? Ok, did you have conditions or a timeframe to leave? None. The intention, just like at the Golan was to steal land. That's Israehell's trademark.
 
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