The pros of state money and taxes management in a federal lebanese state

[Rafidi]

We already know that, the next step is just to codify it and have a more egalitarian redistribution of wealth whithin the invome/revenue of taxes paid within each federal district. If some districts want to hire 1000s of idle workers let them pay their wages, i dont want to

Many here have repeatedly claimed that Christians pay taxes while others do not.

First, I would like to specifically know what taxes do Christians pay that others do not?

Second, they claim that because Mount Lebanon, as a single province, is the most populated and turn out more revenues to the government, therefore it is Christians who are paying. The question: are the taxes paid for example in Dahieh/Baabda and Shouf districts of Mount Lebanon's share to the government? How are we sure without a census that Christians are a majority in Mount Lebanon as a whole? I am not referring to indigenous voters of Mount Lebanon. I am referring to every resident who lives in Mount Lebanon and contributes to the economy of that area by spending. Or are Christians of the opinion that the northern half of Mount Lebanon, which has more Christians in it, pays more taxes than the southern half? Which of the two halves is more populated?

Please can we specifically point out what some claim to be paying that others do not?

This is about specifics. Not wild claims. And if you bring out figures of the revenues generated, be ready to provide the statistics per sect of the payers and residents in Mount Lebanon and each districts of Mount Lebanon and even towns and villages.

And we can also apply this to other provinces which are paying or which are not paying taxes.

Let us specifically know what people mean by taxes that are being paid by some and not by others.

 

[SeaAb]

I expect the next thread created to be titled "What taxes do non-Christians pay?"

 

[Mrsrx]

E500 khouré el day3a

 

[Rafidi]

I expect the next thread created to be titled "What taxes do non-Christians pay?"

I believe this thread covers that, notwithstanding the title of the thread, which specifically highlights the supposed Christian tax payers because they are the ones making claims.

 

[Jo]

It is not only Muslims - This is more related to regions.

For example (and this is just one), where I live, i am required to do a permit to start construction that cost a minimum of $5,000, whereas my father in law who lives in the Akkar region, can just start construction after giving the municipality a phone call.

Note that this is not a "wasta" this is just what the people think is the normal procedure there.

 

[Rafidi]

It is not only Muslims - This is more related to regions.

For example (and this is just one), where I live, i am required to do a permit to start construction that cost a minimum of $5,000, whereas my father in law who lives in the Akkar region, can just start construction after giving the municipality a phone call.

Note that this is not a "wasta" this is just what the people think is the normal procedure there.

"What they think is the normal procedure there"... So whose fault? What laws are they following? Into whose pocket is the money going?

 

[Rafidi]

It is not only Muslims - This is more related to regions.

For example (and this is just one), where I live, i am required to do a permit to start construction that cost a minimum of $5,000, whereas my father in law who lives in the Akkar region, can just start construction after giving the municipality a phone call.

Note that this is not a "wasta" this is just what the people think is the normal procedure there.

And no, lest we drift from the topic of the thread. This is very much about religion and not region. Some bigots on this forum have repeatedly made the claim that only Christians pay taxes to the govt. And Lebanon's economy depends on the taxes of Christians and another bigot says Muslims are parasites who do not pay and are enjoying amenities paid for by the Christian taxpayers. This is a repeated claim. So we may as well look at govt revenues generated by different districts to know where money is coming from.

And if I may add, if Muslims make up about 60-70% of the population and Christians make up about 30-40% of the population (these are generous estimates most would agree with here), even if Muslims as a whole pay less in terms of percentage or proportionally, Christians may not be paying more because they are lesser in numbers. And Christians get more representation in govt. That by no means is justification. Money can't buy democratic representation, even though Lebanese people who are very much obsessed with money won't mind doing that if it had come to that.

 

[Jo]

that only Christians pay taxes to the govt

I think they mean main Christian areas. Mount Lebanon to be more specific.

There is no data for this, but yes, there are many taxes that I pay (in Mount Lebanon), especially in the constructions permit area that people of Akkar and South do not pay.

 

[Patriot]

Oum fek te3li2t l kahraba 3an l 3amood
You’re probably even using your christian neighbor’s wifi to post here

 

[Iron Maiden]

First off @Rachel Corrie , i never claimed in my post that some people pay taxes while others dont. Its a pretty small post u can read it again to make sure.

Second i said that I, living in a certain district, do not wish to pay for thousands of idle workers who do nothing all day from my tax money. If others from other districts wish to do so, its their money i hav no objection with that. Thats the main point toward federalism and codifying decentralized money management.

Third i am going to rename this thread because the premise it entirely flawed.

 

[Rafidi]

I think they mean main Christian areas. Mount Lebanon to be more specific.

There is no data for this, but yes, there are many taxes that I pay (in Mount Lebanon), especially in the constructions permit area that people of Akkar and South do not pay.

So only Christians who reside in Mount Lebanon pay for construction permits? That means you are being unfairly targeted and therefore this cannot be considered as tax payment. Why dont I believe this?

And is Mount Lebanon only inhabited by Christians? I'm not talking again about registered voters. I'm talking about all residents from Mount Lebanon itself and from without.

 

[Patriot]

Tripoli full of white plates taxis

 

[Patriot]

Shiaa running illegal tax free Marijuana business in bekaa

 

[Rafidi]

Oum fek te3li2t l kahraba 3an l 3amood
You’re probably even using your christian neighbor’s wifi to post here

I do not have christian neighbors.

And I am not based in Lebanon.

When I am in Lebanon, I can afford to pay for internet both for my router and my phone.

The thieves in the telecommunications sector lording high taxes, what religion are they from? I opened a thread a while back about the high cost of telecommunications in Lebanon. But many on this forum don't seem bothered or interested. Are Christians benefitting from the high prices of telecommunications? Why aren't they complaining? The govt is indirectly taxing its citizens for making use of mobile telecommunications in proportions that bother on outright stealing.

 

[Patriot]

I expect wonders in property tax payments distribution
Such report should be very easy to pull
I expect 0 property tax payed in Dahieh

 

[Patriot]

Do people even pay for electricity in Dahiye ?

 

[Rafidi]

Tripoli full of white plates taxis

I haven't seen white plates in dahieh or in the south. They are all red plates.

And come to think of it, the cost of running a transport business is another way the govt is indirectly taxing the citizens and making life miserable for them. An average poor guy with kids cannot use his private car and turn it into taxi before paying tens of thousands of dollars as tax permit. This isn't done anywhere else in the world. Against, I recently opened a thread about this. And the excuse is that the taxi owner will have life health insurance. But where is this practice done in any other country around the world- whereby a citizen has to pay tens of thousands of dollars to run a taxi and then the govt uses the camouflage of health insurance to justify this daylight robbery if the poor and the citizens? Again, you guys have no problem with this because this sort of high taxation or rather corruption suits you in more ways than one. You feel your people can afford this much to run a taxi. And of course, the taxation goes into the govt's pocket and you enjoy the revenues.

So if we are to examine only this item, Christians are actually leeching on Muslim taxpayers. I bet there are more taxi drivers that are Muslims and more Muslim commuters. Therefore, more Muslims who pay tens of thousands of dollars to run a taxi business, while Christians go for white collar jobs through which they live exorbitant lifestyles from these looting of Muslim taxi drivers.

 

[Patriot]

I haven't seen white plates in dahieh or in the south. They are all red plates.

And come to think of it, the cost of running a transport business is another way the govt is indirectly taxing the citizens and making life miserable for them. An average poor guy with kids cannot use his private car and turn it into taxi before paying tens of thousands of dollars as tax permit. This isn't done anywhere else in the world. Against, I recently opened a thread about this. And the excuse is that the taxi owner will have life health insurance. But where is this practice done in any other country around the world- whereby a citizen has to pay tens of thousands of dollars to run a taxi and then the govt uses the camouflage of health insurance to justify this daylight robbery if the poor and the citizens? Again, you guys have no problem with this because this sort of high taxation or rather corruption suits you in more ways than one. You feel your people can afford this much to run a taxi. And of course, the taxation goes into the govt's pocket and you enjoy the revenues.

So if we are to examine only this item, Christians are actually leeching on Muslim taxpayers. I bet there are more taxi drivers that are Muslims and more Muslim commuters. Therefore, more Muslims who pay tens of thousands of dollars to run a taxi business, while Christians go for white collar jobs through which they live exorbitant lifestyles from these looting of Muslim taxi drivers.

That’s off topic
The law is there
It’s illegal to run a white plate taxi
Tripoli is full them
@Aoune32! can confirm

 

[Rafidi]

Shiaa running illegal tax free Marijuana business in bekaa

This isn't a thread about crime rate. Hashish trade is illegal. So no one can pay tax for it. Govt is not collecting taxes on this trade. If the growers in the Bekaa are mostly Shi'a, that doesn't mean Christians aren't involved in one way or the other or are immune. And if Christians aren't involved, it isn't out of principles. It is lack of opportunity. Latin Americans and Columbians to be precise are catholic. And Columbia is the cocaine capital on earth. So? Again this isn't about crime rate. It is about taxes. What are Christians paying that others are not. I am tired of sectarian bigoted on this forum repeating this baseless claim.

 

[Rafidi]

That’s off topic
The law is there
It’s illegal to run a white plate taxi
Tripoli is full them
@Aoune32! can confirm

Then the govt should do its job and arrest them.

In fact, in my view, the red plates price is a govt scam.

And it is a way you are promoting because it suits you.