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Unrest in Venezuela - Lebanese are coming back

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  • Dynamite Joe

    Dynamite Joe

    Well-Known Member
    Except you are making all this story up... I never said a word about Maduro or his regime. My immediate reaction to the current situation was that the USA is planning a coup, and the only addition I made was to say that yes the USA is working the coup but it is not as straightforward as it seems because there is popular support behind this, there is a strong popular opinion on the last elections and we can’t discard that because we disagree with the USA foreign politics. I finally said I hope the Venezuela’s manage this in the right way to avoid the “historical effects of American interference”...

    Dakhilak stop making up things and answering them quoting me...
    Fair enough, I went back and read your other posts. My only disagreement with you is what caused the conditions that led to what you describe as a 'popular uprising'. Though I have my doubts about that, let us suppose it is a grassroots uprising, still doesn't absolve U.S. meddling. It wouldn't be the first nor the last time U.S. foreign policy starves a nation's economy to near or full bankruptcy. Venezuela fits perfectly on the target list of the State Department, CIA, Trump Administration. It's an oil rich country virtually in the backyard of the U.S. Since Chavez, Venezuela has insisted on their sovereignty while thumbing their nose at U.S. hegemony. Hence, to separate Venezuela's political and economic woes today from U.S. interference is to deny reality. On the surface, there are the sanctions, in the background all the customary dirty work is being done to destabilize.
     
    Nonan

    Nonan

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Don’t be pathetic, if the country is in economic dire straits, it’s due to the predatory policy of the US to undermine the current government. You can’t just look at the conditions now and ignore what caused them.


    Sent from my iPhone using Orange Room
    Really? Do you know anyone currently living there? Or having had to escape Venezuela? Do you have any idea the dire situation in which the population is and Maduro’s corruption ? Google “the Maduro diet” and you’ll get the sense.

    The US is behind a lot of problems in the world. Alas, this is not one of them
     
    Dynamite Joe

    Dynamite Joe

    Well-Known Member
    Really? Do you know anyone currently living there? Or having had to escape Venezuela? Do you have any idea the dire situation in which the population is and Maduro’s corruption ? Google “the Maduro diet” and you’ll get the sense.

    The US is behind a lot of problems in the world. Alas, this is not one of them
    People escaping from Venezuela doesn't absolve U.S. involvement. The U.S. is already involved by supporting the opposition. With John Bolton as National Security Advisor making threats of sending troops to columbia among others, you may as well start believing pigs fly if this uprising was not the result of U.S. meddling. What you're saying is simply inconsistent with the facts.
     
    Walidos

    Walidos

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Fair enough, I went back and read your other posts. My only disagreement with you is what caused the conditions that led to what you describe as a 'popular uprising'. Though I have my doubts about that, let us suppose it is a grassroots uprising, still doesn't absolve U.S. meddling. It wouldn't be the first nor the last time U.S. foreign policy starves a nation's economy to near or full bankruptcy. Venezuela fits perfectly on the target list of the State Department, CIA, Trump Administration. It's an oil rich country virtually in the backyard of the U.S. Since Chavez, Venezuela has insisted on their sovereignty while thumbing their nose at U.S. hegemony. Hence, to separate Venezuela's political and economic woes today from U.S. interference is to deny reality. On the surface, there are the sanctions, in the background all the customary dirty work is being done to destabilize.
    The sanctions the USA impose are shit and hurt the people of the countries that are targeted. I think the USA sanctions have contributed to the issue, but I think the communist regime that was installed played an even bigger role.

    I still think the USA is making use of the Guaido situation (and indeed very likely created it) to eventually benefit from Venezuela’s oil and resources, but seems like people don’t give a crap at this point so long as they move to a different regime. The hope is that they maintain their sovereignty and have a peaceful regime change... any military attempt will be a disaster and frankly, I doubt any war can start without the USA creating it...
     
    Resign

    Resign

    Well-Known Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    LOL :)

    1549195237853.png



    كشفت مصادر خاصة لصحيفة "السياسة الكويتية" أنّ الأمين العام لـ"حزب اللهالسيد حسن نصرالله، تلقى رسالة من الرئيس الفنزويلي نيكولاس مادورو، وذلك بعد إعلان "حزب الله" موقفه الداعم لمادورو ورفضه التدخلات الأميركية لزعزعة الاستقرار في أميركا اللاتينية.

    وأفادت مصادر صحيفة "السياسة" بأنّ نصرالله، تلقى رسالة من مادورو، أعرب فيها الأخير عن شكره وتقديره على الدعم المطلق الذي تلقاه من الحزب في مواجهة محاولات المعارضة الاستيلاء على السلطة في فنزويلا.

    وقالت المصادر للصحيفة إنّ رسالة مادورو جاءت رداً على رسالة نصرالله والتي أعرب خلالها عن استعداد حزبه تقديم أيّة مساعدة له ولعائلته، بما في ذلك إرسال خبراء عسكريين أو مختصين في حماية المنشآت الأمنية من صفوف "حزب الله" إلى فنزويلا.

    وكان نصرالله قد كتب في رسالته الى الرئيس الفنزويلي: "هذا ما هو إلا النزر اليسير الذي يستطيع حزبه تقديمه إلى الرئيس الفنزويلي مادورو وإلى ذكرى سلفه الرئيس هوغو تشافيز، مقابل ما قدمه الاثنان من دعم إلى "حزب الله" وإلى إيران خاصة في كل ما يتعلق بناحية توفير الأموال اللازمة لنشاط الحزب".

    وأضافت المصادر أنّها لم تتمكن من التأكد ما إذا كان الرئيس مادورو وافق على الاقتراحات التي عرضها عليه نصرالله، مشيرةً إلى تزايد الأصوات في صفوف "حزب الله" التي تدعو إلى رد الجميل لفنزويلا، على حدّ ما جاء في الصحيفة.
     
    Nonan

    Nonan

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    People escaping from Venezuela doesn't absolve U.S. involvement. The U.S. is already involved by supporting the opposition. With John Bolton as National Security Advisor making threats of sending troops to columbia among others, you may as well start believing pigs fly if this uprising was not the result of U.S. meddling. What you're saying is simply inconsistent with the facts.
    You are talking about the current uprising, I am talking about the past 20 years... history didn’t start last week. This is a perfect example of where an initially well intentioned populist (Chavez) starts populists programs that benefit the poor (great) and then 1) becomes a paranoid dictator seeing conspiracy everywhere, 2) badly mismanaging the economy and reducing his once prosperous country (admittedly with a lot of inequality) into a starving dictatorship, after passing the reigns of the country to an incompetent corrupt dictator.
    You prefer to blame all this on the غريب and on Bolton that has barely been in position for a year now, that’s fine. Maybe pigs do fly...
     
    proIsrael-nonIsraeli

    proIsrael-nonIsraeli

    Legendary Member
    The sanctions the USA impose are shit and hurt the people of the countries that are targeted. I think the USA sanctions have contributed to the issue, but I think the communist regime that was installed played an even bigger role.

    I still think the USA is making use of the Guaido situation (and indeed very likely created it) to eventually benefit from Venezuela’s oil and resources, but seems like people don’t give a crap at this point so long as they move to a different regime. The hope is that they maintain their sovereignty and have a peaceful regime change... any military attempt will be a disaster and frankly, I doubt any war can start without the USA creating it...
    US sanctions were imposed two days ago, and yet to have an effect.
    However, Venezuelan unrest started much earlier.

    BTW, do not be upset with US sanction, look at them as great equalizer - now Maduro will have less advantage over Venezuelan people while using government money .
     
    Genius

    Genius

    Legendary Member
    France, Germany and Spain have given Maduro until midnight on Sunday to call a presidential election.

    Now you can add Germany and Spain to the axis of evil ..
     
    Dark Angel

    Dark Angel

    Legendary Member
    France, Germany and Spain have given Maduro until midnight on Sunday to call a presidential election.

    Now you can add Germany and Spain to the axis of evil ..
    Except you are making all this story up... I never said a word about Maduro or his regime. My immediate reaction to the current situation was that the USA is planning a coup, and the only addition I made was to say that yes the USA is working the coup but it is not as straightforward as it seems because there is popular support behind this, there is a strong popular opinion on the last elections and we can’t discard that because we disagree with the USA foreign politics. I finally said I hope the Venezuela’s manage this in the right way to avoid the “historical effects of American interference”...

    Dakhilak stop making up things and answering them quoting me...
    there used to be a thriving middle class in venezuela back in the 80s. however as the wealth of the country was concentrated with two dozen families, the people simply wanted to give them the finger and voted communist/socialist chavez to power. the middle class was soon after decimated and the economy was bound to crumble with or without embargoes, and under chavez venezuela was helping cuba with around 10 billion dollars every year. it was a rather rich country even prior to discovering its gigantic oil reserves.

    it is for the best of the people that maduro packs his bags and goes to spend the rest of his days in cuba. the new regime might very well orbit in the US politics, but that would still be a much better option than a communist venezuela with a starving population.
     
    Manifesto

    Manifesto

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Now with both Brazil and Colombia loyal to the USA, Americans figured this was the best time to decommunize Venezuela.

    Venezuela is now encircled with two pro-American countries that seem open to USA operating a military base on their soil.
    I don't think Trump will miss out on this once-in-a-lifetime opportunity.

    It's now or never.
     
    Abou Sandal

    Abou Sandal

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Venezuela Gold: Bank of England ‘no longer neutral player’ – Richard Wolff
     
    Abou Sandal

    Abou Sandal

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    A War for Oil? Bolton Pushes Privatization of Venezuela’s Oil as U.S. Ratchets Up Pressure on Maduro
     
    Muki

    Muki

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Venezuela will soon get a taste of freedom.
     
    Nonan

    Nonan

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    My Venezuelan friends want Maduro out. All of them, no exceptions.

    Anywhere socialists or Islamists set a foot always the same output. Business is for the capitalists. Yes, they benefit, but they always leave room for others to benefit as well. Look at the UAE..

    Social policies of Chavez, followed by maduro have ruined the country completely. Add to that the ideology of defiance with no means to go agaisnt the superpowers.

    Putin has given around 20 billions as dettes to maduro, and he is trying to keep him in power because if he is ousted, then the money is gone. Lol.

    Only death to America dudes on this forum are pro maduro. Claiming morals and justice. Same claims by all dictators.
    They can keep repeating death to America day and night.
    I agree with one caveat. I wouldn’t say “social policies” only ruined the country. It was also blatant mismanagement and ensuing corruption. You can have social programs and socialist policies that are well managed and well within the means of a country, without necessarily ruining it.
     
    Lebanese Pride

    Lebanese Pride

    Well-Known Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    BOMB THEM! GO TRUMP GO!
     
    I

    illusion84

    Member
    Trump is taking control of South America! Few years ago South America almost became independent; look at them now...

    Anyway it is the people choice, if someone chose to live under American hegemony who are we to tell them no to do so?

    Chavez survived many coups because he had the heart and soul of the poor; I'm not sure that the current president has such popularity...
     
    Abou Sandal

    Abou Sandal

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    Neocon Bolton is committed to punishing apostates who dare resist the writ of Washington


    John Wight has written for a variety of newspapers and websites, including the Independent, Morning Star, Huffington Post, Counterpunch, London Progressive Journal, and Foreign Policy Journal.

    Published time: 31 Jan, 2019 15:02
    Get short URL

    US National Security Advisor John R. Bolton © Global Look Press / Xu Jinquan

    “Whom the gods would destroy they first make mad,” are words delivered to us from history. When contemplating them today John Bolton springs to mind.
    All joking aside, Trump’s national security adviser is to international diplomacy what the Hunchback of Notre Dame was to Pilates. Though reports that he is regularly driven to his office in Washington on the back of a cruise missile are yet to be confirmed, his near orgasmic exaltation of US hard power and military might suggest he would relish nothing more.
    In other words, in John Bolton the world has itself an unrepentant and unreconstructed neocon. A fanatical warmonger who is now, to all intents, Donald Trump’s brain.

    Afraid? You should be.

    The recent picture of Trump’s national security adviser holding a writing pad, upon which the words “5,000 troops to Colombia” were scrawled, is all the evidence needed of the global calamity that is US hegemony and domination. It is not so much the ability of proponents of American exceptionalism, such as Mr Bolton, to deploy thousands of troops almost anywhere they choose in the world on any pretext – like latter day proconsuls of Rome – it’s the fact they assert the right to.

    Issuing diktats from Washington to sovereign countries and governments, threatening them with military aggression if they refuse to accede to those diktats, has been in keeping with the workings of this overweening superpower for decades now.

    However, such action – like replacing a recalcitrant government with another while having zero respect for international law – was previously undertaken covertly but is now, in the case of Venezuela, being done openly and brazenly.

    Juan Guaido, Washington’s newly appointed placeman in Caracas, is but a minor actor in the horror movie that is US power politics. He is one in a long line of such; a here today, gone tomorrow nonentity whose only qualification for the role given to him by Washington is his ability to take instructions. A fanatical hawk like John Bolton would have it no other way.

    Undertaking a character study of Mr Bolton and others of his ilk throws up the dichotomy between their eagerness to hurl soldiers into battle, and personal histories which reveal extraordinary efforts to avoid going into battle themselves.

    John Bolton, George W Bush, **** Cheney, hawks and neocons all, each took steps to avoid being drafted for the war in Vietnam. Bolton was actually unabashed about ensuring that he would not be drafted, writing in his Yale University 25 year class reunion book, “I confess I had no desire to die in a Southeast Asian rice paddy.”

    Instead, like former President George W Bush, responsible for pushing Iraq into the abyss in 2003, Bolton joined the National Guard and stayed home. He also enrolled at Yale to study law before segueing into politics as a strident advocate of might is right, climbing the greasy neocon pole in Washington to positions of influence.

    Speaking of Iraq, in Bolton the war had, and continues to have, its most resolute champion and defender, even though it has long been accepted by all apart from the most mendacious and amoral that it only succeeded in unleashing a carnival of carnage. Bolton went fromstating in the lead up to the war in 2002, “I expect that the American role actually will be fairly minimal,” to in 2015 stating, “I still think the decision to overthrow Saddam was correct.

    Occupying the space between both those statements, made 13 years apart, are the millions of lives lost, upended, ruined and forever destroyed in consequence.

    I am proud to say I was active in the antiwar movement in the lead up to and aftermath of the invasion of Iraq. In those circles, John Bolton was regarded as a cross between the antichrist and Pol Pot – and with some justification given what ensued and the man’s lack of remorse or contrition over the catastrophe inflicted on the country and its people, not forgetting the destabilization of the entire region.

    It was therefore a moment to savour when Tony Benn, a towering figure of the left in the UK and impassioned opponent of the war in Iraq, delivered a verbal battering to John Bolton during a 2008 televised debate on the war and its aftermath. Benn spoke for millions in Iraq and around the world that night. At one point, in words that belong to the ages, he boomed: “There is no moral difference between a stealth bomber and a suicide bomber!

    Bolton, visibly discomfited at being on the receiving end of such a withering and eloquent rejection of all that he and his fellow warmongers represent, must have been wishing his car had broken down on the way to the studio, requiring him to cancel.

    In more recent times, Bolton was key in Trump’s unconscionable decision to unilaterally pull out of the P5+1 Iran Nuclear Deal (JCPOA) in May 2018, followed by the return of even more stringent sanctions on Iran than had been in place prior to the deal. He was also aprime mover of Trump’s decision to withdraw from theINF (Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces) Treaty with Russia, laying the ground for a new arms race.

    The man, to be frank, is a thug in a suit, who since taking up the role of Trump’s national security adviser in April 2018, has rampaged around the world like a vicious dog, intoxicated with the power to threaten, intimidate and bully at will. He is America’s Tomas de Torquemada (he of Spanish Inquisition fame). The only difference is that where Torquemada was committed to punishing apostates who dared resist the writ of the Catholic Church in the 15th century, Bolton is committed to punishing apostates who dare resist the writ of Washington in the 21st.

    Someone who knows Bolton more than most is Richard Painter, a lawyer who served in the Bush administration. When Bolton’s appointment as Trump’s national security adviser was announced, Painter tweeted his dismay along with a chilling warning: “John Bolton was by far the most dangerous man we had in the entire eight years of the Bush Administration. Hiring him as the president's top national security advisor is an invitation to war, perhaps nuclear war. This must be stopped at all costs.”

    I have nothing more to add.
     
    Abou Sandal

    Abou Sandal

    Legendary Member
    Orange Room Supporter
    The issue in Venezuela is not about good or bad policies and governance, nor about what the government did good and what the government did bad. It has nothing to do with it actually. And turning around this subject (which is an internal matter to start with), is in the current situation, equal to turning a blind eye towards the real problem, that is the elephant in the room.

    The only issue here is about Oil thirsty (V)empire who is attacking and destroying a small country in order to take control of its resources. Period.

    Everything else is diversion.

    Millions are suffering and will suffer due to this only. Just like millions suffered and are still suffering in Ukraine, Syria, Iraq, Yemen...And I'm not even talking about Lebanon (that's for those who do not realize that despite years of being targeted by the US, and unless a miracle, the worst is yet to come.)

    A small country that has done nothing bad to any other country on this planet and that does not represent a threat to anyone on Earth, is being viciously and savagely attacked in broad daylight by the World Superpower and its horde of slaves, hyenas and dogs, just because it wants to steal its wealth.

    If this is not enough for anyone to understand where right and wrong are, then there is something deeply missing in the moral compass.

    Time is not for finding some pretext to put some blame on the victim. Time is for standing for what is right and against what is wrong.

    Venezuela is going to be targeted by a vicious war and millions of Venezuelans from all camps will suffer from it. They will suffer if they resist. They will suffer more if they win. And they will suffer the most if they lose.

    Their only hope is for a large Worldwide united front to come to their rescue. That is their ONLY hope. NOTHING else could save them.

    Keep in mind, that countries are put to death one after the other, always for fake pretexts and millions are suffering while people are busy arguing over useless narratives. (depraved times indeed)

    And be sure of one thing: As long as an ogre is controlling this Planet, then Venezuela won't be the last.

    Millions of lives were lost over the last few years and millions are now suffering, and the worst part is that millions are waiting and shall be served soon enough. Just like cattle waiting to be taken to the slaughterhouse.

    So who's next? Any guess?

    Maybe France, why not? After all Macron is a serious jerk and his economic policy is a real failure and his popularity is barely 25%. France should therefore be put under siege and starve to death for the sake of the French people, until Macron stands down, because the French people deserve better, and the first Gilet jaune who proclaims himself emperor of France should be recognized as such.

    Funny...I suddenly realize that each and every country on the Planet, fits the profile and narrative...
     
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